Transcript

Airbnb's Joe Gebbia At The HIBT Summit

Yeah. Hey, it's Guy here. Today we've got another brand new episode from the How I Built This Summit in San Francisco that happened this past October. And this one is from my live interview with Joe Gebia, the co-founder of Airbnb. Now, I first talked with Joe back in October of 2016 for one of our very first episodes. And if you haven't heard about the wild roller coaster ride of starting Airbnb,

You should definitely go back and give that episode a listen. Because Joe and his co-founders, they really went through major changes and pivots and disappointments and failures before they hit on the idea that today, We all recognize as one of the most iconic travel brand in the world. So when I sat down with Joe back in October, I wanted to spend time talking with him about why they never gave up. Even when lots of people were saying

That idea? was never gonna work. Chill. Guy. It is

It is absolutely amazing that ten years ago No one in in this room, no one listening, no one in the world Could have imagined that people would be sleeping at the homes of random strangers. So Let's start with the idea.

the beginnings of Airbnb go back to two thousand eight. Really at this point. Nobody wants to invest in this business. You go uh if you remember the podcast, they emailed twenty investors Um ten replied, five agreed to have coffee with them, none invested. Um I mean I'm not surprised that at the time people were telling you

This is a stupid idea and it's not gonna work. Right? Because that's what you were hearing. from really credible investors like people that These they're investors that picked Google and PayPal and YouTube and Facebook and all of the kind of internet greats that came before us.

And so sitting in their offices, you know It was just demoralizing. To be

A good instinct for a good idea, apparently, based on their portfolio. And to look at you and just say. This is never gonna work. Or There was one investor that will go unnamed who said um

You should really f focus on church groups. And then he said, but you know what, church groups aren't a big it's not a big market, so I'm gonna pass on this. How could you possibly build a company that's based on strangers.

Posting pictures. Parts of their home. bedroom their kitchen, their bathroom, on the internet. And people are gonna pay to come stay in their home. Yeah.

Yeah, that's gonna be big. Yeah, but but but in their defense, Joe, like I think Most of us in this room probably would have agreed with him ten years ago. I mean I think that It was a weird idea.

It was so weird that it was kind of a Dumb idea. All right. forty, fifty billion dollar company today, but let's put that aside. I mean

people were probably saying that to you over and over again, like this is just Like move on. Do try something else. Is that was that happening? You know the the truth is if if you made decisions based on what a spreadsheet tells you. This is not gonna work.

Get a job or start something else. Like it was highly irrational to keep going w with our product. And I'll never forget when we went home, uh Brian, my co founder and I He went back to upstate New York, I went back to Georgia. So the holiday we went home for Christmas, two thousand seven. And you go home for the holidays and what do people ask?

What are you up to? How's the year been going for you? You know, neither of us really had a lot to say about the year except this one time when people stayed in our our apartment during a design conference. And one of two things happened like

People eat were either like Oh my god. Tell me more. This is really interesting. People in the Oh my god.

You're insane. Yeah. And there was something about that visceral reaction that it got out of people. Webrian and I were like

Maybe there's something here. Maybe this is there's there's more to this than we think. There were enough people that wanted to hear more about it that said, Yeah, I'd travel like that. Or, you know, when I was in college, I was through Europe traveling through Europe and you know, I'd get off the train station and uh a woman would be standing there and said Pension with a sign, we'd go and stay in her place. Yeah. So like people started to tell stories about actually, you know. People are already traveling this way. It's just not. Formalized.

Yeah. But when so many smart people That you respect tell you you're wrong. Tell you your idea is bad. When do you know that they're wrong? Did you think they were wrong, or did a part of you think

Maybe they're right. This is the part where in your head as an entrepreneur you go a little bit crazy. Because you bounce back and forth between like Wow, that's a really smart person they said this idea sucks. Are they right? And then you go home and you're like, No.

I'm sticking with this. I'm gonna make this happen like They can't tell me this is wrong. And I think Maybe it's a personality trait.

For me, I you know, that kind of stuff actually fuels me. Mm. Yeah, th there were times at studying design at RISD where Professors would tell me something couldn't get done. And that was all I needed actually. I mean I'm interested about i in this because

Not everyone's wired that way, and and maybe you you aren't either. Maybe sometimes You were You did kind of give up. Well I there here's something that's very important to know about our story. Is that

If you look at Airbnb from two thousand eight onward, You're missing a big chunk that took place before Airbnb. Because I've worked on a lot of ideas that were really bad. You just haven't heard of them'cause they never went anywhere.

And so I I think it really takes Yeah, being What I would say in the gym of entrepreneurship. Where you're just trying things and It doesn't matter if it pans out or not, it's just about going through the process.

I'll give you an example. I was uh working down the street here at Chronicle Books as a book designer. When I first moved out to San Francisco. And Every day I'd leave and

In the room right where I was the exit was, there was this giant industrial-sized trash can, one of those gray big trash cans, overflowing with these white books. And one day I went up and picked up the books and discovered they're completely blank. And I went to my manager at the time and said, hey, what's going on with these books? He goes, Oh, those are the proof books they do before they make a big run of a book. I said, Are they trash? He goes, Yeah, they throw them away. And I go, Can I have them? And he goes, Sure. Look he looked at me really weird, like why do you want trash?

I was like these are perfect. These are like sketchbooks or journals or other things. And So I actually co-opted these books, I throw them in my bag, and for like a year and a half I just gathered these books and I had two thousand of these books. In my garage. Down the street. That I collected, and the cool thing is everyone was different, no T were exactly the same. And then I came up with a rubber stamp, I gave it a brand.

And I sold them online, I sold them uh at design fairs. And uh You know Kind of a silly idea ish. Um didn't go anywhere, but it was just like getting in the habit. You see something and you do something about it.

Yeah. I mean so we we've done a a an episode with About Slack, Stuart Butterfield, who's actually here in in the audience. And um Really the story of Slack is a story of A completely different idea. It was supposed to be a game company.

Call glitch. And that That didn't work. That didn't work out. It was a beautifully designed. They kept at it, they kept going, they kept pushing forward, but eventually They had to give it up.

And that was it. It was that was going to be the sort of the end of the story. And Slack was kind of an accident because it was this internal messaging system that they created It was this amazing serendipitous pivot. How did you How did you guys know

That you should just keep pushing forward. Was it were you talking about this? Was was Brian saying let's we gotta keep pushing forward, were you saying it? Where I go to when I think of that question. We had an experience that those investors didn't. We had three people stay in our home we've for five days. We knew exactly what that felt like. It was magical.

I mean getting to show them San Francisco, getting to Like really go from strangers to friends, but in such a short arc of time. for us was like really inspiring and And one thing you just reminded me of is um A piece of advice that Paul Graham, who started Y Combinator,

Um gave us and gives all the startups. In a start. Do one thing. Don't die. Keep going.

Just figure out a way to keep going. I think your story about Stuart. is so on point because it's just like keep going you don't know like what You'll uncover or what other idea you'll stumble onto You're like you'll never get to idea C if you haven't tried A and B first.

And if you give off on A, forget about it. But And and being mindful of of folks in this audience who are early stage entrepreneurs. There are times when

It's better to kinda pack it in or pivot or give up on That idea and accept the failure and move on, right? Yes, probably. Um

I think it's also worth Remembering that The way that our service started. We thought the big grand idea. was airbeds for conferences.

And we actually started we it was it's very laughable. Thank you. Um We thought that we were gonna be an event website where conferences that sold out, people could inflate an airbed in their living room. And that was the big idea. Our next iteration

For South by South West in two thousand eight was literally a conference website. Um after the the dud of that launch, um we regrouped and listen to people's feedback and then we launched again for the D and C. And that flopped.

And then we watched the fourth time a year after that. And that's where the numbers finally started to click. The product and market actually had a fit. And so I think the the important part there is that We were constantly listening and iterating.

We got it wrong four times. In a row. Um the good news though is that if you launch and it's a dud, you can launch again because nobody knew about the first one. So the being an entrepreneur is not easy. If it was easy, more people would do it.

So like there takes this like kind of psychological um Strength. To stick with it. Even when there's no hope in sight and when spreadsheets tell you to do something else. But is that an inherent quality or is that something that can be learned?

Uh My own experience, um I've I've looked back on my life and I've seen I've I recognize a pattern. That Whenever I've been

Uncomfortable with something. I tend not all the time, but I tend To see that as an invitation to engage in it. So for example

Um, I was reminded recently I was back on Rizzy's campus a couple of weeks ago for uh Alumni Weekend. And I was Walking around campus and I remembered that How uncomfortable I was public speaking. At that time in my life.

I was terrified, sweaty palms, I'd be nervous. Which is a common feeling. Totally, right. And and I knew that about myself, and so I purposefully signed up To be a tour guide on campus. Because I knew it would force me to be in front of people and to have to. Exposure therapy. I didn't know this.

Okay. So I that's one of of the So you would you would force yourself to confront things that you were uncomfortable with, and that's sort of how you practiced And I don't always do that, but there are times where I'm not going to be able to do Th there's something in front of me and I'm like, I don't wanna do that. I don't wanna talk to that person. I'm nervous, I'm intimidated.

Um they're more important to me, the bla bla like whatever the excuses that goes on in your brain. Um Like And I I think an entrepreneur can reframe those things and say, Ooh. Opportunity.

Yeah. You really describe the emotional roller coaster of of doing this and and something that So many founders experience and just kind of grind through it, even if it's difficult. Let's put this in context for for everybody. So

So when you start, you do everything. Um so you d what do we do every role in the company? Um I remember the earliest days. We realized oh wait, um

People are using our service now, we probably need a number for them to call if there's a problem. I threw my number up on the website. As customer service. And um

My phone almost immediately started ringing. And Um from that point for the next probably Gosh, I don't know, year and a half. I was very closely associated with customer service. Eventually we hired a team.

And they took it over and I got to go. Um But this but people would call like in the middle of the night. I'm trying to check into my place in Berlin and I can't find the host. How do I get the keys? And I have to like go scramble, get to the my laptop, look up their account, like

It's like three in the morning in in San Francisco. Just reminded of another story where Um I'm about to go to bed. It's eleven o'clock at night. I am just so tired. And we're still working out of our apartment at this point.

And I'm about to turn the computer off. And I go, Yeah, I'll just check the Gmail inbox one more time. I'm about to close it out. I hit refresh and sure enough, right at the top, there's a big bold black email. Subject line. This says like help with like twelve exclamation points.

Boy, so I click on it, sure enough, it's this couple, young couple in their twenties. Checking into the marina here in San Francisco. They're somewhere in the marina, they're lost, their host isn't answering the phone, their phone doesn't work, they found wifi at a cafe nearby. They said we're s standing at this intersection. of like Laguna and something.

I Just Jump in my Jeep. And I drive to the intersection. And it's at night.

It's eleven o'clock, it's dark, there's not a lot of street lights. I'm driving slow with the headlights on. On the corner. I see a couple with you know the big rollerbags.

And like I had a hat, a scarf, and like um I just like uh That's them. And so I pull up and I I wave in the window. Um And I had emailed them that I was coming, so that it wasn't like this random guy in a car.

I say, hey, it's Joe, I'm here, I made it. And Um at this point I'm like Why don't you get in the car and we'll find a place for you, but I w I had no option.

To take them to I'm just like We're gonna make this up as we go here. And so We start driving back to our apartment and I'm talking to them, How's your trip? I'm really sorry about this. Um we'll get to the bottom of it, don't worry. And um

I I as I'm driving back I realise there's um And they had an extra bedroom because the roommate hadn't moved in yet. The only thing is it wasn't furnished. I'm thinking to myself, okay, I've got a room

How do I get it furnished? The clock is ticking here. We're almost back to the apartment. They think I have a solution for them, but I don't. And Um I get them in the apartment, I take bring them up to the living room and I'm like I get them uh uh a beverage of some kind.

And I said just hang here for a minute, um we're gonna get the room ready for you. Meanwhile I blitzed down the hall. And

I Rip the bed sheets off my bed. And I grab my mattress. And I Drag it through the hallway.

And I'd bring it downstairs. I'd be corresponding with my friend in the apartment. And I get in the room and I go I go to m make this bed quick. They make the bed, I run back upstairs to the couple, I say your room will be ready in just a minute. And they end up staying in the room and um their stay in San Francisco much of fun. Amazing. Joe Gabby, a co-founder of Airbnb. Joe. Thank you so much.

Joe Gabia joined me live on stage at the How I Built The Summit in San Francisco, which happened this past October at Yerba Buena Center for the Arts. We've got two more episodes from the summit coming up, so keep an eye on your podcast feed. And check out our Facebook page for a new bonus video from another summit speaker, Mora Erens Meele. She's the author of the book, Hiding in the Bathroom. And she spoke at the summit about networking for introverts. And thanks for listening to today's episode. It was produced by Casey Herman with music composed by Rem Teen Arab Lui.

I'm Guy Raz, and you've been listening to how I built this. From NPR.