How I Built Resilience: Songe LaRon of Squire

Hey everyone, and welcome to How I Built This Resilience Edition. On these episodes, we're talking with entrepreneurs and other business leaders about how they're thinking creatively during this very disruptive moment. And today My conversation with Song Laron, the co founder of Squire. Squire is an app that connects barbershops with clients. Song founded Squire in 2016 with his best friend, Dave Salvent, to modernize the barbershop experience. And nowadays, their app is not only booking appointments, But also helping barbershops stay open, if they're allowed to. I spoke a song a few days ago about Squire and the barbershop industry, but first.

Song that He actually wasn't at home. I should mention that you are actually in an office of a barber shop right now in Connecticut. Can you hear it? Um that's fine. That's fine. Um so so first of all, our our barber shops in Connecticut

Open. Yes, yes, they are. Um they are open, I think. Connecticut is probably phase three or or whatever the phases where barbershops and other service based businesses are open. So yeah, they're open they're open for business. And what's the protocol in there? Are the barbers wearing masks and the customers wearing masks? Barbers wear masks, customers wear masks, uh there's no waiting. In the barber shop anymore.

customers will have to wait outside or in their car until their appointment time um is is ready. And there's also, you know, social distancing between shares. They spread out the shares so that they're you know, they're servicing less, you know, fewer customers. Uh as a result. I I would say that barbers are probably one of the few uh types of professionals that are very well equipped in this in this new environment, um because they actually go to school for this. In order to get a barber sh a barber license, you have to study, you know, disinfecting and taking different precautions.

So you know, unlike you know, maybe waiters or other types of you know people who are providing services, I think barbers are one of the few that actually already had to get license and go through education. You know, to be prepared for this environment. So I'm a big proponent of uh of barbershop reopening.

This is that. I'm in California. And now barbershops are closed. And I have to be honest, like I'm a little I'm still nervous about I would still be nervous about going. You know, I've I've given myself two very bad haircuts over the last six months with with clippers. And my kids too. But what I mean when you go now to a barber shop

What are they doing? Everyone's everyone's wearing a mask, but are they disinfecting the seats between customers and you know, Yeah, they're disinfecting I mean they already have to disinfect tools between every cut. They should be doing that. Насоин седін арія. Many of them are using uh disposable barber capes.

Um or they're using just uh one per customer so that they'll have a s uh a supply, you know, ready so that they're not reusing the cakes. Yep. lot of them are not doing certain services, like they won't do beard work or they won't do uh shaves, anything that would require the client to remove their mask. Yeah, I I think that there hasn't been a lot of evidence of barb shops being one of the high transmission services. Yeah. With anything, there's risk. There's there's risk, you know, walk out outside any day and there's gonna be some risk involved and it's just a matter of, you know, the balance of how how much you want that service. So it makes sense, you know, if you don't feel comfortable getting a haircut. There was this article you probably saw it a a couple of days ago of a hair salon where um two of the stylists had w tested positive for Covid, but none of the

More than a hundred and thirty customers that went in, you know, over the course of a few days um tested positive. Everybody was wearing masks and it sort of suggests that masks really do work. Maximum to work. Yeah. If there's one thing I wish everyone could could kind of agree on, I I think that Yeah, we're mass work. Yeah, can we can we just say that right now? All of those people Who were on the hike that I went on over the weekend, who were not wearing masks when you passed by me on the trail that was this

Wide, please wear a mask. Please. All right, let's talk brass tacks here, song. So I mentioned a little bit about Squire for people who don't know the app. Tell tell us more about it. Yeah, so Squire is a business management and point of sale uh software focusing on barbershops. So we do essentially everything that a barber shop needs to run their business, from handling the booking uh interface to the back end inventory.

It's really customized specifically for their barber shop industry. And then on the consumer side as a client, um you can actually find a barber shop, uh, book, pay and tip all in the app or on the website. And and what's the business model? How do you guys make money through the business? Um the main way is uh from handling the payment processing. So that that's really core to our business. There's a s subscription component.

Uh so the shops that use our platform will pay a hundred dollars to two fifty a month. And then there's a customer booking fee. Uh so if you book and pay on Squire, you'll pay about a dollar extra, and that revenue goes to Squire. I mean most people don't know this, but a lot of barbers are independent contractors. You may go to a barber shop and they may have a chair there, but they actually are their own business, right? Yeah. So there's Two central models for barbershop business models. Uh one is what you mentioned, which we call kind of the rental model. Reach Barber is essentially an independent contractor. Uh, they run their own business, they manage their own schedule, they go and come as they please, and then they pay rent.

to the owner, usually on a weekly basis. And then the other uh model is what we call a commission model. where those barbers are treated a little bit more like employees. Um, they have certain hours that they come, and in that case They split the percentage of the transaction with the shot. Usually it'll be sixty forty or fifty fifty. And the owner will get a piece of every of every transaction.

Um You co founded this with your friend Dave uh Salvent. Tell me how you guys had the idea. I know I mean you studied philosophy As an undergraduate and then we went and got a law degree and Dave was an old friend, I guess. How did you guys come up with this idea? Yeah, so I actually prior to founding squire, I I was at a corporate law firm and Dave was actually in business school.

And both of us wanted to do something more entrepreneurial, didn't want to go to corporate route. Uh so we would just brainstorm ideas on the weekend and we eventually stumbled on the idea of barbershops and the idea came out of our own experience. I haven't gone to barbershops for decades like most people I started going with my dad as a kid, around six or seven. And the experience of going to the barbar shop. Hadn't changed.

very antiquated, low tech industry. Cash based. Need to call to make an appointment, long wait times. So all those pain points that that we had experienced form the basis of why we came up with the idea of this is something that we wanted to work on. Yeah.

my barber shop, they don't take appointments. You have to sh g get there when the doors open at at eight thirty. And they have a chalkboard. And there's usually a line and it's cash only. It's thirty five bucks and you can g get there at eight thirty. And you might only get an appointment at like eleven forty five. And some days I'll like ride my bike down there.

at eight thirty and then they only have an appointment at a time where I have a live interview and I can't get an appointment. I can't get a haircut. Um But basically that's that's been the model for forever and ever for most barber shops. Yeah, so th and that's that's what we're we're solving. Um,'cause that that's not a really an ideal experience for you as as a customer and it's it's not a good experience for the barbers either. uh in in terms of efficiently Um running the business. But getting a haircut is such such a great experience and it's it's such

uh an important part of your life that you're willing to to go through. uh you know, that poor customer experience uh t to to get the service. Um, but we don't we think that we can make make it better than that. How how have you like how do you approach barber shops? I mean I have to imagine like

There are a lot of barber shops that are like I don't wanna give up my cash or I don't wanna give up, you know, percentage of my business or w or percentage of my income. I mean it's Presumably you get some pushback from potential customers, so how do you make the case for people to sign up? Yeah, I mean we sell to them is that this is gonna make their lives easier. This is gonna save them time and this is actually gonna enable them to be better business owners and make more money. And and we can show them Um that that's what the the software the software actually does. Early on we we did get more pushback uh from cash only shops.

Uh so our focus was more on shops that are Already taking cards. But that's really the trend. Just in the world generally. Consumers are used to paying for services with cars.

So the shops that are cash only, there will be some segment that just doesn't want to pay taxes, quite frankly. But you know, we're seeing more and more, particularly, you know, the newer shops that are opening. they understand that if they want to meet their consumers and provide a really you know great experience to their clients that they have to kinda accept cars. And it it enables them to charge more. You know, we know that it says people will pay more on card.

Versus cash. And if you want to charge thirty dollars a haircut, forty dollars a haircut, as is the case in many, you know, many cities. Um it just makes sense. I have to imagine that bookings are significantly down because there's so many states you can't You can't go to a barber shop.

Bookings Definitely took a dip when the shutdowns started. March, April and our our revenue essentially went to zero. Yep. And we also decided to waive all of our subscription charges to current and new customers um until October because we we knew that their revenue was also gonna go to zero. We didn't want them to have that overhead. So as a result, you know, we expected the squire essentially wouldn't be making any money, but we were okay with that because this is just Such a difficult time. What we have seen though is that that shops Zara customers are reopening, um

They are getting booked out. Um they're getting booked out relatively fast, and then the and then their bookings are continuing to stay consistent. You know, that that just kinda speaks to how much of a need there was, like a pent up demand from their clients to get haircuts. And I think that there's something about just the barbershop experience and and the community element of it that Tipo you know, men in particular really look forward to to that normalcy. and to being able to get a haircut and f feel great about themselves and feel the way things were they were before covet.

Um, so we're s we're actually seeing it for the shops that are reopening. higher than usual bookings. And uh you know, we'll see how that trend continues. In the months to come, so far, that's what we're saying. There's something I read that you you you had r said um about barbershops. Um you call them a fail proof service, which I think is is right. You know, I think you said look, they bring in roughly half the population

Um that needs grooming. But this pandemic, which nobody predicted and nobody anticipated, has shown that nothing is fail proof. Everything can fail. the most resilient ideas. So how have the past few months kind of made you rethink your business model? It's made me

Understand that you could never predict the future. There's always gonna be an unknown unknown. We always thought that that a uh a a recession was coming at some point. Right. You know, the good the gravy train can't go on forever. I always thought that our our our business was was

Would fare relatively well. In in a downturn. Because you know. people will continue to get haircuts. And we've seen this, you know, in in in the past that these type of uh of of services, you know, tend to remain consistent in downturns. I mean this is a total black swan rand. I didn't I just I never would have predicted a pandemic a at this scale.

But If anything, I I've I've uh this has made me believe that our business is is even more resilient than I thought before. um just s seeing how we've been able to kinda adapt to the to the reality and Make changes on the fly, uh push features. that we know our customers uh need during this time.

And as a result, what we've seen in the last two months actually more inbound um and more customers signing up than we ever have in the life of the company. When we come back in just a moment, we'll hear from Song about running a business during a global economic crisis and his plans for getting Squire through the pandemic. Stay with us. I'm Guy Rose, and you're listening to How I Built This Resilience Edition. From NPR.

Hey, welcome back to How I Built This Resilience Edition. Last month, Song Laron was able to raise some pretty significant venture capital, but he's taking extra precautions to make sure that this influx of cash will last squire. For the next few months. Song, I know you guys did a a round that you raised more than thirty million dollars during this crisis, but I have to imagine that you're trying to keep your cash balance sheet relatively strong, um and and probably are cutting costs and Trying to be fairly careful about how you spend cash in case this lasts a long time, right? You need that cash to last to get you through this economic crisis.

Yes, yes, uh yeah, absolutely. You know, when we started seeing um stage three opening, it was a positive sign because our revenue started rebounding relatively quickly. In fact it may and June exceeded uh pre COVID numbers. Just because of all the new business that we're bringing on. So that that kind of showed okay things are trending toward best case. And then now we're seeing stays

closing again, which we didn't ex we didn't really e expect. Uh like California is reclosed. So it just goes to show you can never really know, but um It's always safe to us us kind of assume the worst case and be prepared for the worst case, which we were prepared to go to to go to zero revenue uh for over twelve months. Wow. I thought that that was uh in the realm of possibility. Um, we're getting a bunch of questions on Facebook from our audience. I want to ask a question from Dante Richardson. Um What are some principles that you've discovered and executed over the course of your entrepreneurial journey that have contributed to your success? Uh

One of the principles Is I believe in Bringing the best people. um into your team and really looking for

People that can compliment your skill set and are Better than you or what they do. And uh if you're an employee at a big company, a big corporation, um, you wanna be the smartest guy or girl in the room. you wanna excel over other employees so that you can kinda move up the ranks. Um and you know that that's how you're you'll you'll be successful. As a founder. You do not want to be the smartest person in the room. Right. You you you want people in the room

Um Uh Way better than you. At what they do. So that collectively

You can make the company excel. And that will You know, in turn. Make you successful as a founder. So kinda like a successful founder.

is only as successful as the people that they bring in. And also I I don't believe in micromanaging. I believe in bringing people in and giving them room, you know, to make mistakes, to excel, to learn from those mistakes. Um if you have to micromanage the people that you hire, you probably hire the wrong person. And uh yeah, so those are just two things off the top that that I think are worthwhile.

Um, I'm gonna go to another question from our audience. This is from Claire Murashima. Hello, Claire. Um Claire asks, How have you kept your professional relationships during this time? I mean, with your team, with your co founder, who's like one of your best friends, who's like across the country in LA. Have you been doing that and and making sure that you keep morale up? Yeah, that's that's a great question. It's been a challenge. to keep those relationships remotely. I mean we have had a little bit of an advantage because um we were

Already somewhat distributed. So you know, we had an office in uh Buffalo, New York City. uh our engine engineering team was was all spread out, our sales team was all spread out. So we were already used to collaborating, uh on on on Zoom, uh, you know, and communicating on Slack. Uh, but this is to control a whole new level'cause it just there's no physical presence anymore. Um, so you know, we'll we'll we'll do like

A virtual happy hour. And not even talk about business. Things like that help. It's not it's never a replacement for the physical you know, one to one interaction. Um, but it do it it does help. I wanna I wanna ask you about um

And you've you've you've written about this and tweeted about this, um Black entrepreneurship in America is has declined over the last thirty years. Also, also entrepreneurship full stop has. I mean, there were more black owned banks in the eighties and insurance companies in the eighties than there are today. If you were talking to like a young college graduate, black man or woman, and they were like, Hey, should I become an entrepreneur today? Would you say now is a good time to

Start a business in this uncertain economic environment? That's a tough question. Uh a good question. Um, I do think that The tides are changing. Especially recently.

with with increased attention to the plight of black founders and black people in general. So I think that now is probably a better time than ever. To be an entrepreneur? Uh, black entrepreneur. Um, that being said. It's

Still Yeah, gonna be Challenging. To be an entrepreneur period, let alone a black entrepreneur. You know, the odds are kind of

Against you, you know, to be to be frank. So I would encourage them that If entrepreneurship is their dream and if that's kind of what they see themselves doing. Then

They have to pursue it. I always encourage people to take risk but measured risks. So if you're at a if you're at a Big company. And your um

You know, making a decent salary. Save as much personal runway as you can before making the leave. Understand that you may go six months to twelve months with little to no income. And just know what you're getting yourself into. But I do believe that

entrepreneurship, particularly in tech. uh provides an opportunity for wealth Creation That is In a short period of time.

that is really unparalleled most other industries. I mean I'm I believe in it. I believe in entrepreneurship. You know, clearly that's that's what I committed my life too, so I w I would never tell somebody to not pursue it, but It is risky, particularly now. Uh particularly now.

Yeah. You and Dave really launched your your company after um Or s sort of before, but really were able to launch it with um a grant that you received after entering into an entrepreneurship contest in uh Buffalo, New York. Has it been difficult over the years for the two of you to raise money? It's been difficult. Um so that the f that company's called uh Forty Three North and uh it actually wasn't a grand, it was it's an it was an investment, okay. Um yeah it was an investment six hundred fifty thousand

We won the uh the comp the So that's an equity investment in your company. It was an equity, yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's that's the structure the structure does a warrant that converted to to equity when we raise the a price around. Um but prior to that, um Yeah, raising money is not is is is not easy, particularly at first. As a first time entrepreneur, as somebody who doesn't have a you know track record uh in tech, um and didn't have the network at that point. It was challenging. We were fortunate, both my co founder and I to have a pretty decent network of

Professionals in New York City from like l law, finance and you know, uh o other kind of like high paying industries and we actually were able to get and many of them are African American. We're able to get uh some of our early like friends, no family, just friends around her friends and uh you know, slash angel that helped us, you know, get to the next level. But for us fundraising until we raise uh the series A s and series B. Um, it was always a real Kinda like just a grind. You know, get it get one check.

That'll take us couple of months and then go out and try to get it out. We we never really stopped fundraising. It was it was a constant thing that we were doing to keep the business afloat. And quite a few times I mean we came close to, you know, one month of runway. Uh You're running a business, you're you know, you've got a staff of sixty, you've got to show up and inspire people and be their leader and Um, but also like you are a human and you were in New York in the midst of

mass demonstrations against racial injustice Which um I can't imagine couldn't w was not, you know, was was was an incredibly emotional time for you. Um, and probably some people on your team. How did you guys navigate that and cope with that? Did you talk about it openly with each other and Were there days where you just didn't

You just didn't want to get on that Zoom call? Yeah. Yeah, I mean uh One of the things that kinda unfortunately you have to learn to do as a as an entrepreneur is is is Compartmentalize. Is something

Can be weighing on you that's outside of your business. You kinda have to learn how to put it in a one place in your mind and Focus on things you have to focus and then kinda give it attention when the time is right. Um

Aside from everything that's going on the road just in life, that's that's kind of a skill set that Um, many founders and entrepreneurs have learned that they have to develop Um, so I you know, that that was kinda my my approach to it. It's like yeah, if if I unfortunately if I were to Stop working every time a Black person was killed by the police. Yeah.

Uh it would just be such a distraction. I would never be able to be successful. that's kinda like personally on a personal level what what I've had to do, but as as far as the company goes, yeah, we we try to be very sensitive. to um our employees and what what they're going through, you know, we communicated to them that you know, as a company, we s we stand on on the side of of Black Lives Matter. Um of Black Lives Matter uh shouldn't even be a controversial statement. Um and that um we really want to give our employees space

To to process and we told everyone they could take time off, um if they needed to, if they wanted to just, you know view of their motions or if they wanted to go protest or if they wanted to do whatever they wanted to do. Um we also make Kinda made a statement.

um as as a company, um saying, you know our position and and you know, we made some public donations uh to some non profits. Um so you know, as as a company those are the things that we felt is the right thing to do. Um And you know, on an individual basis as a as a as a black man, yeah, it it is it is It's very difficult. On one side you wanna help, you wanna do what you can to kinda support the movement, but on the other hand, you know that one of the most beneficial things you can do is

Creator successful company. And be an example of what's possible and hopefully make it easier for black founders in the future. um to following your footsteps. So that's really you know, that's what I'm focused on. Yeah.

What do you want to take away with you from this moment? You know, in five years' time when you when you're running this company which will be much bigger, and you look back at this moment, um, you say, I learned that then and I'm so glad that we've carried it into what we do today. What what would that thing be? I think that I'm glad that we've Remain.

One focused on on this Space barber shops. Um and putting our customers first. That that's one of our Core values, um customers are our life lifeblood.

And I think that when This happened, nobody expected it. Um nobody expected, you know. pretty much all of our customers to be shut down and not operating. Um we had to make some decisions about what to do.

And we optimize for doing what would provide the most value. Uh to them. So you know, we immediately switch focus to uh you know, how can we help these people during this time when they they're not making money? How can we help them keep the doors open so that When the shutdown is over, they can reopen their doors.

And I think that so far it looks like those decisions were the right decisions just because of the way, you know, our customers in the market and the industry has reacted. And also um We're seeing, you know, the features that we've rolled out actually really You know, helping them.

Reopen. Successfully. So hopefully we'll look back and we'll say, You know what, we made the right decision and Lord knows what uh crises await us in the future. But uh uh we you know, we're gonna we're gonna have the same approach.

You know, that that that will enable Exquire to be successful. If we can make our customers successful, we'll be successful. Yeah. Song, thank you so much. For joining us. Thank you. This has been a pleasure. That's an excerpt from my conversation with Song Laron, the co-founder of Squire. To see our full interview, you can go to facebook.com slash how I built this. Just click on videos. And if you want to see all our past live interviews, you can also find them there or at youtube.com slash NPR.

If you want to find out more about the How I Built This Resilient series or other virtual NPR events, you can go to nprpresents.org. This episode was produced by Candace Lim with help from Allie Prescott, El Mannion, Gianna Cappadona, John Isabella, Juarney, Neva Grant, Thanks for listening, stay safe, and I'll see you back here in a few days. I'm Guy Raz and you've been listening.

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