McBride Sisters Wine (Part 2 of 2): Robin McBride and Andréa McBride John

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Guy Ross.com And thanks. We did have to go to the vineyards and and find grapes that were available. And then we also needed to find a facility where we could make our wines and we also needed to get licensed to do so. Yes.

And then we also needed to get national distribution ourselves. Like there was an a an immense in six months. You had to do all this in six months. I mean we had to do that really in like Ninety days. Sounds Absolutely terrifying. Exciting. Exciting, yes. It was very exciting. Thrilling.

From NPR, it's how I built this. about innovators, entrepreneurs, idealists, and the stories behind the movements. They built. I'm Guy Raz, and on the show today.

How two sisters took their life saving. Taught themselves winemaking. Shook up an industry with a brand designed for a whole new type of wine drinker. The McBride Sisters collection.

Okay, so I warned you last time. This story is epic, right? And I am assuming you're here because you've already heard part one of this two-part story, how two half-sisters who didn't know the other existed until both were grown up. went on to launch one of the biggest black owned wine companies in the world. But if you haven't heard part one, please stop listening right now and go back one episode in your podcast queue to hear it.

As for the rest of you You've now had a few days to dry your eyes and recover from the first half of the story. Which means we are at the business building part of what would eventually become the McBride Sister's collection.

Now the thing about Andrea and Robin McBride is that Despite both growing up in wine making regions, Robin in Monterey, California, Andrea in New Zealand. neither sister had any real connection to the industry. and neither had any real money to put towards a business.

They were also young women of color trying to break into an industry that's often been dominated by older, mainly white men. But None of this mattered. They didn't care. They knew that they both shared a love of wine, and that they both had a deep and powerful desire to work together. And there was one other thing.

They were motivated. by a mission. They wanted to build a company that would make wine more accessible. to disrupt and demystify the sometimes intimidating parts of wine culture. Grape varietals, how to taste it.

regional nuances, ratings, even how to read labels. And when they first dreamed up the idea of starting a wine company, Robin, the older sister had been working at a corporate job and was married with three children. And Andrea?

Was a college student. At USC. I mean neither of you had A whole lot of startup cash. If any. I mean, did you Robin, did you I mean, you had been working, but you also had a family. Did you have any savings? I mean, not much. You know, it was kind of uh

Nearly paycheck to paycheck situation. You know, I'd gotten married, we had Recently. Purchased a home. But you know, we have brand new twin babies and um an older girl so there wasn't a whole lot of cash available. And Andre, I'm assuming given that you were in scholarship at US C in a college student, you probably were broke, right? Yeah, I mean I got my scholarship checks, you know, on

We're you could get a job and, you know, make money. You know, that was that was what I did. So the the original idea was it sounds like what you guys settled on was let's just Import wine and and kind of put her label on it. Was that the initial idea? So we had this grand vision

We felt like what was really critically important was that We're incredibly passionate about wine. Yeah, students of wine. But we need to learn the business. Of wine.

And you know, we could get this license in California. a a federal importer's license that was like fifteen hundred dollars. It was like our total life savings and We could import other people's wines and we started by reaching out to to families in New Zealand.

And then we could we could learn the business and we went to them and basically said, you know, don't put all your eggs in our basket, but we think California could be a great market. to grow your brands and your wines and We negotiated really long payment terms so we could bring in the wine. Sell it.

click the cash, pay the light bill, and then pay them back and then as a part of like the process was every Harvest. We come back and you guys teach us how to make wine. And you Andre had

obviously some connections in New Zealand. 'Cause you're from there and your family you have family of farmers. Yeah. So when you first approach these wineries in New Zealand do they agree to Um

How did that work? Like how many How many bottles of wine did you initially buy and then w where did you go to sell them? So yeah, so it was crazy. It was at the time it felt like it was an insanely huge amount of wine. Um and it was uh a palette. Which is f Like fifty four case cases, which is like the m the minimum of what you can like put on a boat, you know. Um, but for us that was just an insane and an and and in a case of wine there's twelve bottles. So it just felt like a huge feat to be able to get these licenses because, you know, the the sale of alcohol in the United States is highly regulated. Yeah. Um

And it's very strict. And so just the process of obtaining a a license to import seemed and felt like such a huge rigorous process. And then and then to convince people, you know, to and trust in us and and give us product and then to get it on a boat and then and then bring it into the port of of Long Beach at the time and then put it into a federally bonded warehouse'cause you can't just like bring that to your house. It has to go into a bonded warehouse. Oh my God. Um and then at the point like, wow, okay, it's here. So We gotta go sell it. Yeah. You know? And then literally Googling you know, top restaurants in in LA and and in San Francisco and getting some samples from the warehouse and

Putting them in a bag and And literally just walking into restaurants. All right, so tell me how you did that. Like would you go would the two of you go or or would you go separately? So here's what we did. So specifically for so at the time Andrea's still in Los Angeles, I'm in Northern California. Yes. Barely twenty one at that point, I think, like twenty two, maybe, twenty one. Yeah, barely legal. So um so what we did, and you know, thank God we were so optimistic. And so naive.

And in a sense, that's kind of what saved our butts from a huge failed launch. Um was that Yeah, we didn't We didn't play by the rules because we didn't know what they were. Right. And so and because we didn't play by the rules, we actually

you know, unknowingly gave ourselves some tremendous access to really great accounts. Um,'cause we We know we had a whole lot of confidence and no business experience. So we were doing all the wrong things. But what we would do is we would I would sit up in Northern California and, you know Google like Top ten, you know, highest rated, you know, restaurants in Los Angeles. And then I would just like like the most naive, like dummy person in the world pick up the phone.

And and I would see who was the wine buyer or the sommelier or the wine director or whatever was going on in that restaurant. You know, just really stalk them and be really creepy and then I would find the phone number for them and then I would just call call. And and I don't mean like one time. I mean I would keep calling until I got to that person. And I don't even know what you're supposed to say in those situations, but I would just say like hi, you know, this is Robin McBride. I have this amazing wine from New Zealand. I think you're gonna love it. It's gonna, you know, be blah blah blah. Like when can we come in? And

You know Knowing what I know now, that's ridiculous, but at the time I think people were just sort of set I back, like are you are you s You serious? You're calling me on the phone, you know, talking about this. And

I just was really, really for assistance. And so we got an appointment and there is a certain protocol where, you know, your distribut goes in and takes you in and you set appointments and you know, this whole thing that you're supposed to do. We and we just didn't know that that's what you were supposed to do, but You know, they would see us'cause we were just so persistent because we didn't know we were doing the wrong thing. Did Andrea did your Like I imagine if you have a French accent and you go and you talk about the French wine just selling, people kind of just psychologically think of you as maybe legit Did your New Zealand accent m maybe kind of help you out? No.

No, okay. Um because this is the thing with wine is that It's When you think about the great wine regions historically in the world there are

usually in what we call the old world, which is Europe. Right. Usually France. And very aristocratic, very formal. There's a process. There's guardrails around who does want So when you come up from a place of where you just don't know what you don't know. Um It's startling for people, I think, because they're

I think in their mind they think. How dare you? Like the audacity, you know, don't you know how this works in this industry type of sort of approach and When you think about the wine business on the winemaking side, on the ownership side, even within the higher ranks of distributors.

It's mostly older men. So I think What was startling was Uh And why my accent didn't help me was because

I was so young. I was a woman. And I was a woman of colour. Yeah. At that time. Um the wine industry was

with a very close knit closed off industry. With T a lot of deep tradition that we that we respect. But at the same time, um, not a lot of

Innovation, not a lot of disruption. And so we looked very foreign in the in these situations. What was the first restaurant a client who who said, Okay, yeah, we'll buy a couple bottles. I I can cite one in in San Francisco that was a very it was a it was a learning moment for us, but ultimately became I think probably our first Um

you know, r really notable account anyway, where I I was doing my my cold calling routine that I do. Yeah. This particular person and this particular restaurant um I called and Um he he's a sort of famous

kind of s um and and wine maker that purchases the wine for this big restaurant group in California. And I called and He was completely incense. I mean he yell he yelled at me.

He said don't chew ever Ever call me. During service hours. Now again us not knowing what the rules were Um, I said, Oh absolutely. What exactly what time might that be? You know, so that I can call you back.

And he just said, You know, before he said, I don't know, before, you know, two or three. I said, Okay, absolutely, I'll call you tomorrow before two or three And he was Like he screamed at me and he hung up the phone. And I was like, how do you Google? I'm like, what is he talking about service hours? Like, what does this mean? And I was like, oh, that fully makes sense because a restaurant, you know, begins prepping to begin serving their customers, right? But we had absolutely no experience, right? But whatever. I mean, you know, we don't you know, see many things as failure. It was like, Okay, good, now we know. So going forward we will never call these house during service hours and that ended up um being it's in San Francisco, the the main restaurant is in San Francisco and that ended up being our first

really large, um for us at the time. Um restaurant account that had multiple locations. But how did you convince him to Eventually buy your wine. Because our wine was amazing and we don't take no for an answer. So by the time that we called during non service hours and we uh you know, after I'm not sure how many attempts it took, but we ultimately were able to get in there and show'em the wines, which we knew were amazing. And that was luck. That was luck. Yeah. Felt like we'd made it. We made it.

Here's the question, right? Like now you're run a wine list with like Hundreds of wines. Right, and you're a New Zealand wine competing with like probably rich people who are like gonna buy burgundies or whatever, you know, whatever it is. How do you at that point How can you get the the Somaliers to to encourage people to try your wine.

Well, this was a New Zealand Sauvignon Blanc that I think was like twenty four dollars a glass. Oh wow. Okay. So it was an expensive wine. Yes. Yeah. And I think at the time what we had on our side, this was like pre two thousand and eight. And New Zealand seven blanc, I think, for the the world wine industry was this new kid on the block that just exploded. So I think in terms of timing

That was our star, you know, in our portfolio. And then we also had some really just beautifully Gorgeous wines from New Zealand. And so it was a a really great time to be introducing people to Um something in you. So really it was the two of you like

Working the phones. And cold calling and just hustling and probably hearing a lot of no's. And and did those nose. ever make you feel bad or I mean or or w m how how were you able to stay unflapable and to just keep pushing forward through those nose. I think it comes down to again sort of what drives us and a little bit of DNA probably also that we might not be able to take credit for. I'm not totally sure. Or maybe it's just the challenges of the backgrounds that we grew up

in that we're a little a little resilient, you know, so I don't think We've ever interpreted anything that we've experienced as a failure. Because it's all part of, you know, a process of finding out what Yeah. And I think also too it was

Our goal was to Foinery. And our mission. has always been Two

transform the wine industry to lead by example, most importantly to cultivate community. That's something that we saw that was like really lacking. Yeah. Did you um How long did it take you to sell that? That pallet of wine, that first shipment. Member.

I think it it took us uh about six months. Um within that six month period. There were so many learnings, um, that then they're after the reorders happened a lot quicker and the south row was a lot quicker. And y presumably your expenses were pretty low because you guys didn't have a physical office, right? And and y you were just kind of

living modestly, like both of you will be. Yeah, but you still gotta pay your mortgage and your light bill. And your light bill and the rent and Yeah It it sounds like initially'cause'cause New Zealand whites, um, Sauvignon Blancs are like considered to be value wines. Obviously there are premium ones, but generally value wines. But it sounds like initially you were focused on the premium Right some some of the more high end wines and you were servicing high end restaurants. Yeah, initially. Yeah, in the wine industry, premium, I I know it's a little bit c like it doesn't make a lot of sense, but premium is anything that's over thirteen dollars a bottle. So for the most part, most like New Zealand Sauvignon Blanc is sort of over that threshold. Um and then, you know, super premium I think when is it like over twenty dollars. Yeah. That's like ultra premium. Yes, but we but we definitely were in the higher end.

And um we're attracted to that because that is sort of the geeky nature of us. learning about wine intricacies and everything that comes with it.

А та сам тари клірли. The Jack's position of A lot of this isn't accessible to everybody. How do you democratize the wine experience? Because it just seems like When you philosophically, like when you think about wine, it's

You know, it's it's the bond of nature and people and community. Yeah. That's been going on for like eight thousand years. And that communal connection it creates with food and humanity and love and friendship. You know, I feel like you know, wine is history and it's and it's culture and it's optimism in a glass, and everybody should have access to that. Not just a select few. Yeah. And we felt like it was a problem, you know, for for us to solve. um that wasn't being addressed anywhere else, which was how can we

help more people experience wine in in a better way. At every level makes sense. In including economic sense,'cause you think about like these really expensive Burgundies, right, from these chateaux in in France and you know, peop people will buy, you know, a case of of their wine for you know, they'll get on a list and they'll they'll they'll get their allocation and they'll pay twelve hundred dollars for a case and they'll go and sell each bottle for twelve hundred dollars, right? And those small winemakers

who are producing small amounts of wine for very elite clients, they're not getting rich off the wine. They're not reaching and they're reaching a tiny Elite. I mean it makes Infinitely more sense. to reach a wider audience at a lower price point. Yes. And that was that was I think we were

paying very close attention to The different aspects of the wine making process. That translate to quality.

And how could we craft these wines in a way in which by the end, once it passes through importation, distribution retailer once it gets the consumer is still this really, really high end wine and product that overdelivers in the quality but isn't gonna break the bank.

Right. And the goal eventually, in your minds at least, was one day we are gonna have our own We're gonna make our own wine or were you not quite there yet? Yeah, I mean that was the eventual goal, but it was fast tracked by two thousand and eight. And so when the financial crisis happened

you know, the global global economic financial crisis. We had a couple of things going on. There was a Bumper harvest in New Zealand. So very, very large harvest that created this huge surplus of wine. All those fantastic restaurants, you know, that had those The clientele with the

the large expense accounts they all dried up. Yep. And you know, restaurants for the most part make a pretty good revenue off of their alcohol and their wine, so they stopped paying their bills and Uh Robin and I got to the point where we just said, wow, this is really, really hard.

trying to figure out how we're gonna survive this. And came to the conclusion that Um, if we were gonna keep on doing this, we should do it for ourselves and At this time it was like now or never. And this was a time that we should

Make the jump. And start a wine company. Naturally. I love this. You're thinking, hey, you know what? Let's just let's just use this opportunity, this financial crisis and economic crisis, to to actually double down on our business and And pivot. Yeah. When you say it it sounds so crazy, but yeah, that's exactly right. It's like well we've gotta do something so we're not just gonna sit and be overcome by, you know, this this crisis that's going on. We we have to be strategic in some way. And so we felt like for the amount of uh effort and energy it was going to take to keep any business afloat right now it might as well be our our own for our own products.

So how are you gonna do that? I mean presumably there's a glut of of wine on the on the in in New Zealand on the market. Was the idea that you would kinda take advantage of that glut and Buy up some of that wine and then Put your label on it? Well well we we had that that problem from the beginning, which, you know, is cash. Yeah. Um, so so for us it was looking at strategic partnerships.

So looking at this this problem of there was this excess of New Zealand wine Everybody at New Zealand wants to be in the US market. How could we partner with an already established wine company that had infrastructure, that had all the things that we couldn't afford to do. And we could find a

Synergy And them really being like the infrastructure, us making the wine. Um, and then us now having the expertise not only to make the wine, but also to import it, distribute it, and sell it in the US market. Who did you find? Who who did you find a partner with? The company doesn't exist now. Um, but at the time, um They're called the New Zealand Wine Company.

And In two thousand and nine, Robin and I made our first wine together under the Eco Love brand. This is the brand that you you created with this winemaker. Yes. Yes. And and just to clarify, you were gonna have uh a role in in sourcing the wine and then this company was gonna bottle and distribute it So like did you like did you go down to to New Zealand and and sample a bunch of different wines that they were making or w was it already made or Did you like how did you decide w which one you wanted to Yeah, so pr like the four years prior, Robin and I had been

um sharpening our skills. you know, and learning how to make wine. So we were very particular to New Zealand. Yeah. So we were very particular in Yeah. From a growing perspective. what we wanted and then from a wine making perspective

what we wanted the final product to be. In Mulborough, uh we have the northern valley called the Wyrao Valley. And then we have the southern valley called the Awater Valley. And the Wao Rao is the older Ha Of Marbury, and it's much warmer.

And uh the The Awati Valley in the south is a lot Uh cooler and it's more exposed. And as a result Uh

And the wines. Um, and the northern part of the region you get ones that are that have this more tropical flavor profile. A lot of um passion fruit, a lot of gooseberry, and then also peaches and and also red grapefruit. Versus the the Awate Valley is

uh jalapeno tomato stalk. And Robin and I um felt felt very passionately about producing a wine that had a very tropical spectrum of flavor. And that's what we produced. So you went down there and You knew what the flavor profile was and did you literally like wine like wine producers will literally g tell

Um you know the vineyard. Pick the grapes now. Right now. Like I'm I'm tasting this grape, please. We want them right now. The sugar levels in the grapes are perfect. W was it were you doing that at that point or not quite yet? Absolutely. And and this is the thing, like the most amazing thing And this is really really specific to seven yant blanc grapes, but putting a severe blanc grape in your mouth, all the flavor just in general when it comes to wine comes from the grape skin. And and putting this grape in your mouth and just tasting Like the flavor and the skins. gives you a vision. of potentially of where it's gonna go. Once you once you harvest, once you pick once the fermentation process starts, you really don't have a lot of control. How do you um this is just a bit of a digression, but how do you'cause when you are going

Yeah at that time and you still do it now, but when you when you're going to A vineyard and you're picking a grape and you're popping it in your mouth. First of all. Wine grapes. are really sweet, right? The sugar content is much, much sweeter than table grapes, right? Because you need all that sugar to create the the alcohol. Yeah.

How do you know? When it's the right hour or day. of the week to pick them, how do you know? Because it's gonna taste in the skill test. You can do all the science. You go and pick some grapes you there there's there's chemistry behind it. So it's not it's not just like your palate and the the magic of the state. I mean I w I wish I wish my I wish my mouth could properly calculate bricks in in the grapes, but there is a way to to go out and to to you know grab a baggie full of grapes and take'em back into the lab and measure the the sugar contents um to see where it's at. Right.

Alright, so you partner with this wine New Zealand wine company. And they bottle this wine. And by the way, how much did you want to sell each bottle for? This is two thousand eight, two thousand nine. What was the idea? What was the price point you wanted to hit? Sixteen ninety nine. Yeah, between fourteen and sixteen ninety nine. So not super Inexpensive but affordable.

And How much wine did they Did they how many bottles or cases did they end up Producing and shipping to you. So our first our first vintage, I think it was two thousand cases. It was nearly three thousand cases. Okay, yeah. Robin Rob Robin's the keeper keeper of the coin. Yeah, I'm I'm I'm the keeper of the booth.

But I think after the first year it was about twelve twelve thousand cases. And at this point,'cause it's now you're two thousand nine, you're in the really the heat of the financial crisis and really an economy that's slowing down. Were were restaurants your target or now were you shifting to targeting retailers? Both. So so we were still knocking on doors.

We were still going to You know, restaurant accounts that survived. And then we started to there was a lot more um sort of neighborhood wine shops. Um also that we're we're coming around independent, you know, retailers. What was uh and and and how many employees did you have at that point in two thousand nine?

Two. Two I mean me and her. By two. Yeah. Yeah. Right. Mm-hmm. And and then maybe some ha people like sort of working part time or on contract to help you sell. But it was a tiny operation. And still primarily in California. Yes. In LA, San Francisco. Yes. And just literally

Going to s wine shops and wine bars and Personally like pitching this wine. Yep. And I I think the biggest breakthrough at that time, somehow somebody tipped us off that at major Corporations across the United States. Um

And even within grocery. There was a department called Supplier Diversity. and the soul function um of the supplier diversity director was to identify um women in minority owned businesses to try and help bring them into those grocery stores. I think it was through Supervalue, right? Yeah supervisor. Supervalue was a large grocery chain in the

middle of the country, I guess, and they had a supplier diversity director and we were like, What is what is that? What is they do? Yeah. Um The person at the time was a a man by the name of Michael Byron. And I remember Robin and I We flew into Min Minneapolis. That's where our Super Value was based. I think it might have been like January or February where It was eleven below. And this is in like two thousand nine?

Does ten. ten, eleven, something like that. Would have been January two thousand eleven. And Um Really like giving us

the lay of the land of like grocery retail, like a real education, and then letting us know like that he was he was there to really help us understand that customer and how we could be successful. And even better was He said, you know I'm gonna help and I'm gonna support you, but where else do you where else do you wanna sell wine? And I said, I said, Hm and he said he said, Yeah, we got a whole network of us. And like the next day he sent out emails to Target to Disney to all the major like Carger, all the major Fortune one hundred, you know, companies in America. Like getting us a seat at the table. Well, you know, grocery has always been

really important to us because we felt like That's where Woman shot. And that's where we want it to be. Right. And so

Cost plus world market wanted to Um put our wines into their stores. Nationally. That then for the first time took us outside of California. I mean I imagine this was a huge um like a huge breakthrough for the business but but

But I imagine it was still not You still weren't like We weren't rolling and doesn't know. Yeah. You weren't rolling and do, yeah. Did you I mean it's interesting'cause in between two thousand nine and two thousand eleven, right?

financial crisis a lot of businesses go under So But I suspect that wine is one of those weird things it does okay, right? Because It's like It's a small thing that

You know, makes people feel a little bit better and it's a nice little luxury. Right. Is that is that what you saw? Exactly. Exactly. It is I don't want to say it's recession proof. Um because

the channels in which you operate. definitely play into When a recession hits, for sure, when it comes to the wind industry. But I would say for the most part, um You see that can

lessons out and and restaurants and what we call on premise accounts. But more consumption happens at home. This is I mean you you kind of alluded to this earlier, but Th that the whole like wine making

World. Um and it's changed a lot, of course. Um, but there is this kind of culture, right? It's still v v you know overwhelmingly Made And produced by men. Uh most of those men are white.

And Mm-hmm. Did you guys encounter um you know along the way winemakers who were dismissive or who were I don't know, a bit condescending to you, or did you find more winemakers who were actually generous and really wanted to share what they knew? I think there's there's two different sort of sides to this. I feel like for the most part, people on the winemaking side, on the grape growing side Are pretty

Jitterous and welcoming. In terms of time and information because at the end of the day As much control as you hope to have, Mother Earth like dictates what's gonna happen. And I I definitely feel like there is a community a really big community aspect to the wine. the the growing and the winemaking side of things. Right. Because a lot of wine a lot of wine doesn't win makers don't grow their own grapes. They're grown by farmers who and people have plots on those, right? And they're there are farmers and and and w wine is just I feel like it's one of those You know.

Kind of old school mentality just in the terms of You are open. With um information and with assistance to your neighboring farm.

I think it's a little bit different, however, when you move away from the agricultural side of it and the winemaking side and you get more into the business side when you're dealing with um gatekeepers when you're dealing with wholesalers, distributors and retailers, it's very different than the The base of the wine making and agricultural side. somebody who you you s you you try to sell wine to and they're just like ah it's terrible.

Like was kinda snobby about it. Well, uh there's a lot of really snobby people in wine. Um but I don't think anyone's ever said to us, at least not to our face that our wine was terrible. And and quite honestly, I I I don't think anyone would have a reason to because we work hard to make sure that we don't make make terrible wine. But I mean there's definitely You know, depending on what part of the wine world you're in where you're definitely going to face some pretentiousness, you're definitely going to face All of the things that a lot of people really find intimidating and distasteful.

um about wine and that's lessening, I think, you know, over the years, but it's been an unfortunate an unfortunate side effect of being Um in the wine industry. Yeah, I I'm wondering, um, because I think I think like right around twenty fifteen

Um you guys entered into Another partnership uh with Diageo, which I I think it's either the biggest or one of the biggest um alcohol beverage companies in the world. And and again, like you're sourcing the grapes and and you're blending the wine, but it's still Distributed by Diage, right?

Right. And and I'm just using this as one example of a partnership you did, um, which makes sense because then you don't have to go out and raise a bunch of money and they they're well capitalized and you can have a partnership, but I mean And this is a tricky question, okay, because The wine you're producing is your idea. It comes from your minds. It comes from your experience. It comes from your

palette. It's your intellectual property, but I'm assuming that when you do a partnership, it it doesn't work out that way. Is that right? It's it's quite complicated, honestly. And you know, there's a lot of ways that you can structure those kind of partnerships, whether it's you know, a marketing and distribution um relationship or or production or or what have you.

Um But At the end of the day, no one is going to have the vision that that we have, right? I mean that's, you know, unique and specific and generated by by us for us. So even in the best situation, there's still going to be Сам елемент of where where

a larger company in an entrepreneurial um vision is is not going to align. And look like Robin and I w wear too much. Like we're the most. We're a lot. You know, like we don't sleep, like this is our passion. And then you know, then when you are

partner with a company where, you know For a lot of people, you know They aren't as passionate as you. They were sleeping on the weekends. It was crazy. It was like not how do you do business like that. And big bureaucracies. There's and don't and don't get us and don't get us wrong. Obviously like it was a sh it was a short partnership, but we learned so much. You know, we're so grateful that we had that experience. But at the end of the day, we're still we're still scrappy, agile entrepreneurs with a very, very strong vision. Yeah.

who we are like throughout rose. colored lenses, the way that we see the wine industry is very, very different. If we were going to bridge this gender gap that happens in the wine industry and Make the wine industry more inclusive.

Tell. We had to do that by ourselves. Because політиклиний стратегіч Партніші. It was just too difficult. Right.

And you know, we had to Realized that, you know. This is something that we we simply need to do for ourselves. So what did you do? Like how were you gonna Make that happen.

So we went to lunch one day and And this is sort of at the time in which Robin and I are really heavily talking and thinking about like our future and, you know, should we stay with Diageo. And then we went to lunch with the spire and he said I I get your vision.

I see I see what you guys are trying to do. Have you guys ever considered Just breaking off on your own. and creating a McBride sisters completely like McBride sisters. Brand.

And your answer was yes, we have been of course Since two thousand and five. And what store was Inspire with, by the way? So it's Kroger. Kroger is the company. Yeah, he was kind of like I don't get it. He's like, I don't get it. Why why are you guys making, you know, all these things and quite honestly it just you know we weren't quite sure how much brand equity there was and putting our own name on the label. But your answer presumably was if I'm with you I'd be like, yes, we wanna do this, but we don't have money to do this. Yeah. And so so we said absolutely like yes, we wanna do it. I just wanna add like as as any proper entrepreneur, you you say yes and then you go figure it out. And you freak out and you figure it out. You figure out how to make it happen.

And we come back in just a moment. How that lunch with the guy from Kroger turns into a life-changing deal. With a nearly impossible deadline. Stay with us, I'm Guy Raz, and you're listening to how I built this. From N PR. And one more thing, the New York Times best selling book, How I Built This, is now available.

It's a great read and a great gift for anyone looking for ideas, inspiration, wisdom, and encouragement. to have the courage to put out an idea into the world. It's filled with tons of stories you haven't heard about how some of the greatest entrepreneurs you know and respect. Started out at the very bottom. Check out how I built this the book.

Available wherever you buy your books. Hey, welcome back to how I built this from NPR. I'm Guy Raz. So before the break, we heard how Robin and Andrea were about to end their partnership with the multinational company Diaggio.

and launch their own independent wine company. And right around the same time, The sisters had a meeting with a buyer from Kroger, who told them he wanted to stock his grocer shelves with McBride sister's wine. But the question was Could they do that? all by themselves.

And this is September. of twenty sixteen. Right. And you know, he's talking about going on shelf in March of two thousand and seventeen. And at this point, you know we have no f no significant I mean, we're talking about to do this as multi-million dollars to be able to pull this off. How were you able to do that without

Going I mean, I'm I imagine that there may have been investors who were approaching you saying, We want to invest in your business. Am I am I am I right? Uh No. We we wish. You know, you have to remember that in terms of You know, in investors in in investments that you know black women are the least

Funded. You know, of of all entrepreneurs. So there were still You know, sort of a perception of some risk or some unsurety. You know, black women aren't seen in this space as um you know, having a history of being successful, if if at all, even being present. So No, there weren't people beating down the door to invest in our company. And and basically this buyer for Kroger says, Okay, it's September of twenty sixteen and the buyer says, Well by March of twenty seventeen we want this on our shelves. That's

That's insane. Yeah, that means it needs to be like sh shipping to their locations in January and February. How much wine, by the way, was did you have to make for that order? Twenty five thousand cases of wine. That year for the first year. And you didn't even have a brand yet. Correct. Correct.

You've gotta get moving. You've gotta get this wine made and bottled and a label designed and slapped on that In six months. Yeah. Yeah. You sound very relaxed about this. I am I am really nervous. I am really nervous. Well,'cause we're on the other side of it now. So um but basically Robin and I had to go out to a bunch of people and say, trust us. In New Zealand.

And California. Wineries. Yep. All over. And it was all gonna be Sauvignon Blanc? No, no, this is four varieties. So this is Sauvignon Blanc.

Sparkling brute rose from New Zealand, and then a Chardonnay and a red blend from the Central Coast of California. And just keep in mind that ninety ninety percent of the like ten thousand wineries in the United States make less than five thousand cases a year. Wow. So so but this is September, so this is like the end of the harvest, right? In California at least. It is it's right in the world. It's harvest in California. The harvest in New Zealand is the other side of the calendar, right? Our spring, yeah. Yeah. And so you presumably you have to go to these wineries very quickly and find the um the the wine, the blends, and make this wine and convince them to Make this for you and

Fast. Yeah, so we had to but we so we had to find what we call components. So we had to identify You know, wine that was already made. find these components that fit our quality standard. Blend up all of these wines at the same time.

negotiating contracts with growers for the car the the coming three vintages. Yeah. And basically saying to these people, We don't have any money, but we promise that we'll like pay you when we get paid. And quite honestly It it was even more complex because we did some of'em we did have to go to vineyards and and find grapes that were available. And then we also needed to find a facility where we could make our wines, and we also needed to get licensed to do so. And then we also needed to get our wine our our domestic wine making team together.

We needed to get our compliance and our operations and distribution team together. We had to get national distribution ourselves. Like there was an e an immense. Six months you had to do all the stuff. I mean, we had to do that really in like Ninety days. Sounds Absolutely terrifying. Exciting.

Excited. Yeah. It was very exciting. Thrilling. Presumably your comp you're at this point, like most of that w that those grapes are spoken for. Most of those wine facilities are already They've already got contracts. Yeah. But you had I mean you had of course some relationships already in New Zealand and California. Did you have to beg and plead with some of these people? Yeah.

Absolutely. But at this point, you know, we had a history. We did have a name for ourselves. We had a track record of success. And we did have, you know, the largest seller. Of wine at grocery. In the United States saying. You know, we want to bring in your product, so that that went a long way. Did you make the deadline?

Yeah. You did. So so by March of twenty seventeen you were shipping these were being shipped to Croger. No, it was on the shelves. We started shipping in January. We started shipping January and February and it was on the shelf across the country by the beginning of March. Wow. I I will say though, I think I lost like forty pounds. Or thirty. Thirty or forty pounds. No, literally I did. It was crazy, right? I lost some hair. I lost like forty pounds, but we made it happen.

And so did you how did you get the word how was the how did the word get out about the Lions at at Kroger? Did they do demos? Did they promote it? All of our packaging. Um even though it's like very simple. Um we know how c Most ninety nine percent of consumers label shop.

You know, and so we were really very, like, very particular about building in these quality cues that we knew that if the If people didn't know anything about us, we knew that our price point was right, we knew that the packaging, the quality was right, we the varietals that we chose were very specific to

popular varietals from the regions that we grew up. Yeah. And that would Carry us a really long way. What did the labels look like? We created a family crest. Of course.

Why not? And so the McBride Sisters Crest is a combination primarily of of two animals at the top is a peacock. And so this peacock is representative of our father. Um,'cause he definitely was a cocky gentleman. And then the peacock is sitting on the two letters MS, which is obviously for the McBride sisters. And then on either sides of the MS are two lionesses. And those lionesses are representative of either of our mothers because they were fearless. You know, they ran the pride, they're out working, they're out

bringing home the bacon, you know, taking care of the kids and so, um We made our own family crest and We created this crest in two thousand and five with the dream, you know, of we're gonna have a winery one day. And so um it wasn't just created in seventeen, you know, it was it was created back then. And this was the first time you could use it on the bottles. Yeah. How did the wine do at Kroger?

Exceptionally well. So in terms of being a new brand Like into the stores. We were the number the number one new brand in their stores. You know, at the end of twenty seventeen. Wow.

Twenty eighteen also a turning point. Um I guess you were From what I've read, you were invited to sponsor to be the wine sponsor for the Essence Festival, um, which is a a a cultural and music festival in New Orleans. And um You decided to produce a wine that is now one of your mo most famous wines called Black Girl Magic. Yes.

Tell me a story about about that idea and how that came about. Yeah, so we we got invited to host the opening party for Essence Festival. And every year you have One million. uh black women descend on New Orleans over a three day period and during the day, you know, it's this empowerment

sort of uh daytime conference and at night a music festival with headliners like Beyonce and Janet Jackson and That year there was just so much. Black girl magic going on from Women becoming judges to from a sports standpoint from you know winning awards and entertainment. The the it seemed really obvious the best way to capture and honor.

Not only what was going on in the in the moment, but paying homage to All of the women that have paved the way for us to get to where we are today. It felt like Black Girl Magic by the McBride Sisters. would be something nice and festive sort of to capture the moment. And then we we decided that we wanted to make

A Riesling that was uh The great Rieslings of the World come from Germany. And also from the Alsace recent region in France. And so we were trying to bring our new world expression uh of this and really elevating and creating a really super high quality. um off shy racing and We went to Essence Festival and you know we were sitting up for the event and putting the wines out and it was just mind boggling. Like we've never in our lives had people react to a wine label.

Let alone the wine. Like we did at Essence Festival in Robin and I just looked at each other and were like, whoa. We were like, uh oh. We probably should have made more. Probably should have made more. And we need to make this in a And to a range. Yeah. And most importantly

I think unfortunately the wine industry has just really ignored Black people. When it comes to wine. And so Really, we feel like

Black romantic is something a term Obviously Robin and I don't own Іно, мир стюардс. of this brand in E free time there's like a moment.

for black women in which they can celebrate. Whether that's you know, you got a promotion, you had a baby, you became a judge, you became a ballerina, like whatever it is, like we just wanted to be able to be there. Celebrate With her With just like beautiful high quality wines. Yeah.

You so you you're in retailers. And You've got your finally got your own label and then Two thousand twenty, the year of crises and misery for so many of us.

Pandemic hits. Um, and that's the first challenge of this year. Were you guys worried? um that your it w your business would be would be hit. Yeah, absolutely. We were very worried and we took really, really quick measures, everything that we could think of to secure our business, to secure Um you know, to make sure that we uh didn't have to let go of any staff.

We just reduced expenses, we buckled down you know, right away over the weekend because it was just too too unknown. And did you see an instant drop in business and revenue? No. No. For us because grocery has always been such an important channel to us.

our business wasn't significantly um affected As other wineries, unfortunately, that you know, like five thousand cases or less, they're heavily dependent on the cellar door.

And so one of the things that that Robert and I doubled down on at the end of twenty nineteen. putting together our e commerce platform and really heavily investing into it with the goal strategic of slowly building it.

Direct to consumer model. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Selling through our website. Not knowing that there would be a pandemic. I mean you you were just doing assuming just I guess assuming that this is this will be a small part of your business, this this direct market. Yeah. We we we thought that we were just laying the foundation, that we were starting to put the framework together to overtime develop that sector of our business. And then of course come the pandemic. Um We were kind of like to our team who had started that work, we were like

Guess what? It's it's go time. This is now um the company's main focus. And then it also coincided with Um Our children. So with Robin's

Daughter who's We always said if you want to join the family business. That's contingent on You need to go out and work somewhere else.

And Identify avoid that we have that we don't do well. and then come back and interview for a position and come and fill that bo void and and make the company greater. And

She got her degree in k communications and um digital marketing and she went out and she worked for Um digital marketing agencies for two or three years. Um and then finally She said that she thinks she's ready because You know, like Andrea said, we were always like when you have something that you can add to the company, let us know. So she felt she had enough expertise.

And here you are in the midst of a crisis where digital marketing skills are pretty crucial, pretty critical. Yeah. And I can tell you we would in term you know, we had like a shopping cart, you know, in an online platform with some wine for sale and I didn't even really pay attention to the revenue. I know that sounds awful, but you know, maybe it would do like five thousand dollars a week. I just you know, it was such a small number in comparison minimal to to our wholesale business. And then she told us she's like, I'm gonna come in I'm gonna put together a strategy and then I'm gonna execute on the strategy and and she's like And you auntie, and you mummy, you know, just need to like let me do my thing. I think I'm gonna be able to

deliver the results and the return on investment that the company needs. And so, you know, of course we're just like, Okay, I doubt that, but we'll see. You know, and then really from the time from the first week that the plan was in place She took, you know, that revenue from five thousand to like thirty thousand. And I was like I was like, Whoa, hold on for a week to a hundred thousand, to two hundred thousand to And and and and this is like getting the word out through like Instagram and Facebook ads and and digital ads and things like that. Exactly. Okay, so you've got this direct to consumer model. We're all in this covet pandemic.

You um You know, you are now finally reaching the customers that you felt were underserved for so long and then We get to um

May June of twenty twenty and massive demonstrations against racial injustice in America, the biggest demonstrations in a generation in the United States. And you are I mean you're black owned. Winemakers.

And on top of just contending with the challenges of the pandemic You're now contending with the emotional challenges of watching this all over the country. Mm-hmm. Yeah. It was

I think originally it It was like here we go again. And feeling like exhausted and defeated and in one of those moments where I think for myself, you know, I'm the biggest optimist in the world.

But really in that moment, just feeling Like Where do we go from here? And I think I think you know we had this um

Opportunity for a light to be shone on Black business owners with Black Out Tuesday. And one of the things Robin and I had been working on since January. Was At National Grocery.

We're the only A lot of the times we're the only black owned company, we're a lot of the times we're the only woman owned company. And um one of the things that we were working on was You know, we shouldn't be the only one. And so

We started to kind of look around and think about how can we help other people get here as well. And then we start to try and figure out like is there a is there a list? Like is there a list of black vetnors, you know? And and when we're talking about black vetnors, we're obviously we're talking about not just the United States, but in France, in South Africa, you know, you know, wherever. And We couldn't really find a really good comprehensive list, so we started putting together our own list.

And then that night that we found out about Black Tuesday, you know, we called everybody in the company and we said, you know, instead of just talking about ourselves tomorrow. Let's shine the light on You know, black Vent this list that we have, it's like sixty se sixty seven. um black fitness that we could find, you know, in the world. Like let's publish this list and shine a light on our community. And I think at the time maybe we had

thirty five thousand people on our Instagram. We have like thirty thousand likes on this post and it had been r reshared. Like can't even tell you um how many times but most importantly Um a a large percentage of the fitners that we talk to were sold out of their vintages. And it it just showcased for us like the power of our community. And I think for the first time,

This like the the power is really with us and our community. The strength of community is so important. you know, I'd I'm w at this moment where we're talking, um, your you cannot buy Black Roll Magic, it is sold out. Yeah. I'm the sister that's responsible for making Things happen in a timely fashion and we're actually bottling more today and for the next couple of weeks. So we will have some available for everyone very soon. But it's a it's a sign that suggests that you saw a spike in your business.

Oh significant, significant. In in May alone we gained eight thousand new points of distribution. Yeah. You know, these places where You wouldn't expect to see wine being sold and definitely at the price point in which Black Girl Magic is

It's not you know, we have An awesome uh seven eleven in Texas That She was selling three thousand bottles every three days over the over the weekend. For a twenty four dollar bottle of wine from seven eleven. She owns a seven eleven. That's insane. I mean I I know that and I know that you you guys, you know, don't talk about your your financials and and uh totally respect that but

Is it fair to say you're selling many hundreds of thousands of cases of wine a year? Or you're on track to do that? That's fair. Yeah, that's accurate. Wow. I mean, You have you guys have been

grinding at this for fifteen years. Yeah. Right. I mean lon longer than that. But really for fifteen years it's been A long journey. And you're now a significant player in the wine business in America. Mm-hmm. That's correct.

I know that throughout this interview there were moments where you said, Yay, we made it You know, and you were kind of joking about it a little bit, but Yeah. Can you say that now? Do you feel comfortable saying that? I think honestly The same optimism that we started out with when we had a palette of wine.

Um, is very much what drives us today. At the same time, we feel that we have a long way to go. You know, I I think some people might give themselves a goal of a certain you know, number of cases or a certain you know, dollar uh re revenue. But on Andrea and I We dream really big. And we always have. Is your ultimate goal to to have your own vineyards and your own grapes and your own

Production facility. Yep. One of the one of the things that we were we were looking at At the beginning of this year and Last year is But still having a place for people to come and gather. Like a tasting room. Yeah, absolutely. To experien win making.

Vineyards. Wine you know, lifestyle, culture. All of those things you need to have a welcoming place for for people to come and spend that kind of time. So that is part of the the hope and dream to find a plot of land where you can have

Some vineyards and a tasting room and a place where people can see how the wine is made. Yeah, and also a training place as well. So if you're a if you're a woman, if you're a person of color that's interested in the grape growing, wine making, or on the ownership side of the wine industry, this would be a place where you can come. And feel welcome. Yeah. So it's like we would love to see more women as head wine makers. We would love to see more women um

uh that are the head of like viticulture and grape growing. And then on the business of wine Um executive leadership at distributors, making the purchasing decisions at retailers. You know, all throughout the business. So

Here's something that is gonna happen, um, in in m in my experience on the show interviewing you know, hundreds of of of just entrepreneurs with You have already been or you will be at some point. Approached by

A big company that wants to buy you. Mm-hmm. Um because you are in a very, very desirable market and growing very fast and

You've got a really strong brand. Um, is there a world where you could see An exit like that. I can't call it. Like in this moment.

I'm very attached to my name. Yeah. Um I think. I can never say like no one's ever come to me and Robin and said, Here's a chick for five hundred million dollars. Um we don't know what that feels like. But I mean that could happen. You know, no, I I can't honestly sit here and and say to you knowing that that's intergenerational wealth. Knowing just

The basic principles of compounding interest at a very low interest rate of what that will do f for the legacy of our children are grandchildren are great, great, great and also philanthropically For the community that we want to support. Yeah. But I think that we can probably safely say I mean I think it's hard for us to envision one because our

Our Personal. name is not for sale, so that's a that's a little tricky. But also the brands that we create, um, you know, each of those Brands has a very powerful

uh message behind them and like Andre said don't that don't belong that don't belong to us necessarily. We see ourselves as the stewards um of the the purpose behind them. So If you know, and any exit or any acquisition you know, there would have to be some very string stringent Agreements behind that.

Um, I don't know that we can really think of any large wine companies that would be you know, in a position to to to acquire what we think those are worth that would be able to uphold the mission behind each of those brands. Not saying that it would never would happen. Uh but I would I would probably say it wouldn't

Be now or any time soon. I can't stop thinking about Your dad. And and what he would think about all this. I mean h how you got to this place. Yeah.

Because so much of the story is unbelievable. I mean you didn't know the other sister existed. And then you know, once you're both grown up, you eventually meet and then you form this incredible bond And now you've built this

highly successful brand. I I I I just have to imagine that that your dad, if he was sitting here right now He would just be blown away.

Well, quite quite honestly And now I'm I'm speaking as a sister who never actually got to know him at all, but from what I know of him. Um I don't think that he would have expected anything less from us. I think that he also um

Dream very big. You know, he came from a very, very small, and I say small, like five hundred people or something, co country town in Alabama. um you know moved himself to Hollywood. Um and became a part of that scene and an actor and you know, and everything that was kind of wild going on in Hollywood in the seventies and eighties and

Um, you know, my my ent my understanding of him and my interpretation of of him is that um, you know, sky's the limit. Like you you can and should do you know, w whatever you set your mind to. So in my mind, and I've thought about that before, in my mind I think I don't think he'd be surprised. I think that if he was in our lives he would have expected that we've done at least what we've done. Yeah, and I think I think the context of Our family has family of His generation.

You know, Camden, Alabama. You know Grandparents. Our aunties and uncles, our father picked cotton, they're shearcroppers. You know, and I know in their lifetime

Never thought that They would see a black president, I know that. So like Robin said I think You know, he dreamed really big, um, expected this of us, but I think the expectation Also comes from

All of our family. Uh in terms of What they did during the sixties and the fifties and all of the Things that they fought for. So that Robert and I could do what we do today.

They must be so proud of you. Oh, trust us. Auntie Anime Mae is very proud. You can't go to her house without her pulling out a magazine and telling you, Well, let me tell you. She will tell anybody who listens. Do not challenge her about her nieces. But it is very true in our you know, our aunts and uncles our dad was the youngest of like twelve, I think. So it's a very very long generations, you know, they grew up in rural Al Alabama Um just outside. So you know, they did they walked, you know, the M and Petus Bridge. They were involved in the civil um rights, you know, um demonstrations and movements and

We're not unaware of of how close we are, you know, and and how our roots are so intertwined with, you know, all of this. this history and that we're we're not far from where all of it started. So Um and we're in agriculture. We're back in agriculture. Like like the history of black people in America. Is grounded in in agriculture.

Great. grandparents were enslaved and where our Father was born. In the back. In the in the small house in the back.

And I think that, you know, like his journey in life to um move on from a lot of that. difficult history. um was for the purpose of on tr his children and Andre and I being able to do s something like exactly what we're doing. How much of of this story and and the success of this business do you attribute to just your hard work and your intelligence and how much do you think has has to do with luck, first to you, Robin?

I would say ninety nine percent of it is our hard work and intelligence. Um, and then there's a small percentage that I think is what people might refer to as luck. But I really think it is your ability to recognize opportunity and take advantage of it. Same thing. I feel like it's

It's Hustle it's hard work, but it's smart hard work. And it's being able to Identify opportunities. When when other people don't

Or maybe can't see those opportunities. Yeah. And then I think in terms of luck, I don't know if I believe in in Luck? I think

I think you You prepare yourself, you're ready. Um And then if if an opportunity presents itself then you're the right

person the right place at the right time. Stay ready. Yeah, stay ready. That's Andrea McBride John and her sister Robin McBride. By the way, in addition to the McBride Sisters collection and Black Girl Magic brand,

Robin and Andrea have launched a third brand. It's a collection of four canned wines. A rose, a Sauvignon Blanc, and a couple of spritzers. It's called She Can, and some of the money from sales goes back to a scholarship program for small businesses. Owned by black women.

Robin and Andrea say two of those wines are dedicated to their mothers. And the other two? to their daughters. So much for listening to the show this week. You can subscribe wherever you get your podcasts. If you want to write to us, our email address is hibtnpr.org.

If you want to follow us on Twitter, we're at how I built this or at guy. And on Instagram, it's at Guy. Roz This episode was produced by Rachel Faulkner with music composed by Ramteen Arablui. Thanks also to Liz Metzger, Dereth Gales, JC Howard, Julia Carney, Neva Grant, and Jeff Rogers.

Our intern is Farah Safari. I'm Guy Roz, and you've been listening. how I built this. This is NPR.

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