Transcript

How I Built Resilience: Live with David Neeleman and Tristan Walker

Hey everyone, so as some of you know, we've just started a new series of conversations on Facebook Live, where each week I'll be talking to founders and entrepreneurs about how they're dealing with the new normal that we're all experiencing right now. And in case you miss these conversations live, We're going to be posting an excerpt right here every Thursday in your podcast feed. And today we've got two guests. Later you'll hear from Tristan Walker, the founder of Walker and Company. But first, let's start with David Neileman, the founder of JetBlue Airways. The airline industry has taken a huge hit over these past few weeks, and it's likely air carriers won't be flying at capacity for the foreseeable future. Now, David is no longer involved with JetBlue, but he has founded two other airlines since then. One is called Azul, and it's one of the biggest air carriers in South America. So, of course, COVID 19 has had a direct impact on his business. David is confident people will fly again, and that his airline?

Will survive this crisis. You know our our business is off ninety five percent. We had nine hundred flights a day before the crisis. We're down to under fifty flights a day. Wow. Our revenue um we were doing Uh something close to ten million a day and now we're doing um you know five percent of that. So you know it it's it's uh

It's a big challenge and but w you know, one of the great things you know, when you build great companies, you have great people. Um, you know, we have about uh thirteen thousand. people who work for for Zul and So we went out to the to the group and said, Hey, you know, everybody Um, we're gonna need your help here.

Who would like to uh take a few months off without pay? Um and remarkably enough Uh, we had almost ten thousand of our people say Uh, we love this company, we want to save this company, so We're gonna we're gonna bow out for a few months.

Wow. Which Is astounding. And it just says everything about About our people and You know, I I think that gives me great hope that uh you know, we're gonna be back and we're gonna be back strong because

you know, these people are are truly amazing and it makes me all more the the resolve to really save those jobs, every single one of them, and make sure that they're all back to work. You know as soon as possible. David, um What's your sense of sort of the domestic airline situation? I mean, we're talking about potentially months, many months of

very, very little air travel. Um Do you think that Domestic carriers are going to survive this? Um our major expenses that we have are obviously our crew members, you know, our salaried uh folks. Um That's number one. Number two is fuel. Uh, we're not flying so we don't have that expense.

And number three is obviously the cost of our aircraft. Um We have great business partners, uh people who have provided our planes, they know the position we're in. So we're not burning fuel. You know, a lot of our salaries have been reduced and

Those that supply our planes for us have said Hey, don't pay us for six months. We're good. You know, we'll you catch up to catch us up later. And they know it's gonna survive. In addition to that Moving to the US, to your question to the US.

You know, the the aid package that was given to the airlines was was fifty billion dollars. Uh That's a lot, and and it was done for a reason. So there were some strings attached to the to the aid that was given. Number one It said that you have to you have to pay your people through the end of September and you can't lay anybody off.

So that's where You know, a good portion of that money's gonna go. It's gonna pay salaries for these people. The second thing is And they said you need to maintain service to a s to a minimal level to the cities that you had. Service too. And so we have a lot of flights flying around with really few or n or no people on in some cases. You know, these airlines were very strong um financially.

uh before the before the crisis. You know, I I was talking to one you know airline executive in the US and they said You know, we're probably gonna be twenty five percent smaller. If we come back in a few months. But if this goes for a year, we could be fifty percent smaller.

Or more. So you can imagine I mean just one in one major airline employs a hundred thousand people. And so it's critical that we we get this right and we figure out Not only had a had a Deal with this issue. But we figure out how to stay with it as opposed to always having this thread of shutdown, open up, shut down.

That's an excerpt from my conversation with David Neileman, founder of JetBlue Airways and Azul Airlines. If you want to see our whole conversation, you can check it out at facebook.com/slash how I built this. So Another industry that's been heavily impacted by the COVID-19 crisis is the beauty industry, salons and barbershops in particular, places that require human connection and touch. Tristan Walker is the founder of Walker and Company. You might have heard his episode on how I built this. And they make shaving, beauty, and body products mainly for people of color. And a lot of those products are used in salons all over the country, salons that are now closed. Anyway, in twenty eighteen, Tristan's company was acquired by Procter and Gamble, and today he's still the CEO of Walker and Company. I spoke with Tristan from his home in Atlanta, Georgia, where he's been leading his employees through this unexpected new reality.

So first and foremost, um when this started to happen, we didn't make sure that our people were taken care of, right? Um, so you know, we um started work from home about four close to five weeks ago, um kinda we saw this coming and wanted to jump ahead of it. Um, but I had to very quickly realize um that we all had very different situations, right? Um much like me, I had two kids at home, I had to kind of moonlight uh quote unquote as a a pre-K teacher now, right? Um so one of the first things that I encourage everybody to do, and this is kind of about modeling the way. Yeah, I had to block out the sections in my calendar where I just could not participate. In work.

Right. Uh my kids needed to complete their schoolwork um and I needed to afford them the time to do that. And I encourage all of my teammates to do the same. Uh and frankly, as a result of it, um, you know, the business has been doing just fine. In fact, um when we think about, you know, online orders. Uh folks are still buying from us. In fact, we're probably three four X uh our daily sales uh online up since the start of this, right? Um, but the thing that's most important, regardless of any of that stuff, is that our people are safe and well. Yeah, for sure. Tristan, um for a lot of people watching, you know, they're running businesses, small businesses, and and you know what it was like to have a small business'cause you started your business started out as a small business. Yeah, right.

What are ways that you can think of to kinda keep the morale going, like with with your team, for example? Yeah, I mean it's it's hard but doable, right? Folks have their own unique schedules. Thank goodness for things like you know, Slack and text message, among other things, right? Um, you know, we have folks sharing kind of what they're watching during the quarantine. uh what hobbies they're learning, what drink recipes they're learning, right? Um and yeah, we also have other channels of engagement. We see what folks are doing with their children on Instagram, right? Um and we can engage with them there. Uh it so for us it hasn't really required a daily fixed time of engagement.

Right, because we're still working throughout the day and speaking with each other. Um, but I think again our our respect for each other's schedules, our respect and transparency for what's going on. uh but also sharing some of the things that they're learning in good moments I I think is is refreshing. How are you able to reassure people who are nervous about I don't know their job prospects or their economic situation? Like are you guys able to retain everybody and and avoid layoffs for now? Yeah, yeah, we have. Um you know, we're fortunate in our partnership with Proquer and Gamble. We're very, very fortunate, but also recognize uh that not everyone has that luxury. Even though it feels unprecedented.

It's not unprecedented. Uh we've been through all types of recessions. Um You know, it's a lesson for all of us uh to learn how we can prepare for issue situations like this, whether it be kind of cash preservation, um, you know, ensuring that you have a kind of tight, loyal, excited, hopeful, mission oriented team. Um and the rest is you know, you just gotta do the work, right? And follow a strategy that matters. But Um, you know, the thing that I can say at least is be hopeful. And know that, you know, this is temporary.

it might last a little bit longer than expected. Um, but it is temporary and there is light at the end, I believe. I here's a question from Michael Peterson. Um what advice would you give to somebody starting out in this Current climate. Yeah. Um

You know, I think we talked a little bit about this during uh the how I built this episode live. Um Know your why. Right. This is really an important time. uh to not start a business just to start a business. And yeah, one theme during our conversation, Guy, was really feeling like you're uniquely positioned to do the thing that you're doing.

And you know, it it's not necessarily uh the financial potential benefit of doing that. It's um the the happiness and the joy that you find in times of um great success and potential failure, right? You persist. And it's really critical that you actually know your why is why you're doing it, right? It it sounds so simple, it sounds almost aloof.

Um, but I can't tell you how many times folks don't really understand the answer to that question. And when you kind of answer it for yourself, ask yourself it again. Answer it again and then ask it again, right? Um and yeah, everything will fall into place if you feel that you are uniquely positioned to do the thing that you're doing, right? The stuff will pass. Uh and you will have acquired a bunch of learnings to be more successful on the other side. Tristan, this is a question from um

Chris Bears. How do you think this pandemic is gonna change your business? Yeah, I think it's um I I try and take a kind of more Global worldview.

Right, um I'm a part of Procter and Gamble, right, and seventy eighty billion dollar revenue company that serves five billion people around the planet, right? Um, but let me go back to, you know, this idea of humanness. The way we interact with each other. Right. After this, are we gonna keep shaking each other's hands? Um, you think about the comfort of working from home, you know, this idea of four day work week, five day work week, now you can't work from home, you can't be more productive.

Some people actually might like it, you know? Um You know, what does this mean for, you know, um our appreciation of each other? Right. I am craving for human interaction right now. I I really, really am, right? Um, but it it it makes you realize the things you took for granted before. Um and we're all gonna have to

Actually expect everything to change. No, I know it's crazy to imagine how we are gonna interact in formal and informal settings. Um this is a question from Andre, he's twelve, he's from Malta. He's watching in Malta. Like how are you continuing with production and deliveries. Procter Gamble is the mothership now, which in in a lot of ways has built resiliency, right? If you were a startup on your own, you might be in big trouble right now. Having Procter Gamble be behind you actually gives you some stability and security. So how are you dealing with Producing the product and and getting it out to customers.

Stability, security. Brock Done Gamble's been around for 180 years. They've seen this sort of thing, right? They started as a smaller company and became something that was not small. Um, so the ability to learn around what resilience really means for a company that's been around for so long is an inspiring one to me. So I I wanna kinda make that Make that clear.

Um As far as production, um we are subject to the same issues that most others are. Um, yeah, we have one product right now that's on delay until June. It is one of our kind of top products. Right. Um it's actually our T blade uh that connects with our trimmer.

And we're finding ways to kind of get it to our consumers more quickly. But again, this goes back to being transparent with your consumers about what's going on. And fortunately, we're in a position where everybody can understand. Yeah. But there are lessons to be learned out of this. Right. You gotta manage your demand better. You gotta diversify your production, right? You gotta, you know, hoard more cash in the future. Um so you know, I think of everything as an opportunity for learning. Um as opposed to the potential um issues that you're dealing with in the present. You know, I was talking to Jenny Brittenbauer of Jenny Splendid Ice Cream a couple weeks ago on the show. Um

And she said, We're so busy, we're we're always like rushing around You know this better than anyone running a company. Um that there's very rarely time to just stop and innovate and to just think deeply'cause To come up with new ideas or new products just requires time. And like head space, right?

Like are you finding that you actually have some space right now to To do some of that thinking. Uh We have no choice.

Right. Innovation doesn't really happen sitting in a kitchen and hoping for the best. The way I think about it, it requires some physical activity, right? I walk around kind of the block around my house multiple times without any phones. Uh, without any music. And things may or may not pop up, right? Yeah, it took Walker and Company

Thirty years. to get the idea to do it. From the time you were from the time you were a kid. From the time that I was born until it happened, right? Um but you know, that was a result of kind of living life and having things kinda fall into my lap and understanding that there was an opportunity. It's no different today. You have to just afford yourself time to be able to Look outward. Yeah. So much of what your like brand is about is human connection.

Like people touching their faces and people kind of showing people how to use Your products and I mean, does some of that change? Does does that human touch and human connection change? I hope not. I'm still gonna be going to my barber, right, getting my hair cut because I sure as hell need it.

Um but you know, I think those norms are thought of on both sides, right? Um, you know, there's a principal and client relationship, right? Um that my barber has with me. as I have a principal and client relationship with our consumers. we need to be thought about how we package things, right? And you know, she might need need my barber might need to be thoughtful about the sanitizing stuff, right? All that jazz, right? But we just need to think about the secondary tertiary impacts of um you know how we interact with our clients. Which is good for everybody anyway. So you know, I'm hopeful.

That it does change for the better, but it sure as hell will change. Um, this is a question from uh Vincent Brathwaite. Um out of the out of all the books that you've read One, which one influenced the way you do business and which one influenced your personal life. Oh interesting. Um It's probably only one business book that really helped me think about how to be a better just

CEO day to day. Um, and it's High Output Management by Andy Grove. He's very good at distilling why you need quantitative and qualitative metrics in the assessment of your People or output, et cetera. I think personally

You know, one of the the best books that I read was um Race against the machine. Um yeah, you have this one percent, ninety nine percent issue going on. Uh and the the idea is that folks at the top are leveraging technology in ways to make them help a lot more productive, right? While folks in the 99% are not. So how can I actually help to close that gap? uh to ensure that we're all participating in new this new innovation economy.

And the reason you know one would think that that's like um impactful as a business leader But it really does change the way I think about everything. Right. um the types of businesses I want to create into whom. um the respect of diversity around the world, right, and its impact on um consumerism, among other things. Uh it has fundamentally changed the way my kind of world view.

is now. It's it's um and has impacted other things that I read. Right. Um, and I'm more choiceful and purposeful in the things that I do. recognizing um this very important issue, which I think is one of the most important in the world right now. Yeah, for sure. Um this is a a question from uh terra G Camozi um

What about productivity tips? I mean, obviously we're all balancing different, you know, different situations. You've got kids at home and you've gotta look after them and run a business. And stay productive. I have to say that I have been a lot more productive lately. E every moment of the day is work and being with my family, it's it's kind of intertwined.

But like for you, how are you able to kinda stay productive? Yeah, I remember when I was in high school, um there was this exercise that was given to us. Um and you know the exercise was very simple. It had um a sheet, it had every hour of the day from midnight to midnight. And then you just block out what you're doing during those times, right? So eight hours of that time of sleep. Let's say four hours, five hours of that time was class. Um then another let's say three hours of that time of studying, right?

There's still left over something like six, seven hours of the day that can actually be used productively. Uh and you realize how much time is wasted uh doing things that you don't necessarily need to do. You know, throughout this time, you know, I have my sons at home, I have to, you know, do their continuous learning, that sort of thing. But also had to realize for myself, I am not a trained Pre-K teacher. I do what I can and we make best efforts, my wife and I, um, to do as well as we can. Um, but during the times those six, seven hours of free time that you don't really recognize. Yes. Taking care of yourself, right? Forget about productivity and work because that's already accounted for in those hours we hadn't talked about.

Take time for yourself. What is the hobby? I read a lot and I make time for myself, right? Um, you know, when I mentioned a little earlier how we, you know, you have to model the way and block out time so the other team members can actually see that. Yeah, I think that applies across the board, whether that be at work, family, friends, et cetera. But if you just do that very simple exercise, you'll be surprised. by how much time you have to do the things that you didn't think that you had the time to. Um really really quickly before we we wrap up, Tristan, um, in five years from now, when you look back on

What is the thing that you that you do today, that the change you make. That makes your business more resilient in five years from now. I don't think that there's a change in so much as my reflecting back. On the fact that I was consistent.

And you know, I talk a lot about values, as you know. And yeah, we've been through a lot. you know, layoffs in the past, right? Down rounds, up rounds, all that stuff. Now we're going through this kind of Covid nineteen crisis. And it's important that our people know that I am consistent in my judgment, right? Consistent in my courage, consistent in my loyalty to our people, and we're doing things that make everybody else realize that that consistency is there. Because there'll be another one of these in the future.

whether it's Covid nineteen or something else, right? Um and you gotta really make decisions um clearly. Um and I'm most proud when I recognize that I did things that are in line with my values and I was consistent throughout. And that's really the most important message that I would give to anybody, but I would be most proud in five years if I reflect back on it.

And not only I felt that I was consistent, but the people who supported me through this. know that I was being so, in so much as their willingness to continue to be led um into the future. I love it. Tristan. So great to see you. Thank you so much for doing this.

Tristan Walker. Thank you. Thank you. That's an excerpt from my conversation with Tristan Walker, founder of Walker and Company. To see the full conversation, just go to facebook.com/slash how I built this. And we're going to be putting these online conversations in your feed every Thursday and hosting the actual conversations every week on Facebook Live. Next week, we're going to be having live conversations. Every single day with chefs and restaurant owners who can talk about how the food industry is handling this crisis. We're going to be talking to acclaimed chef Daniel Hom of Eleven Madison Park, Christina Tosey of Milk Bar, Sime Nustrat, author of Salt Fat, Acid Heat, Alice Waters, Jose Andres and Kyle Conaton of Single Thread. So join us live

Every single day next week at twelve noon Eastern. at facebook.com slash how I built this, we'll have a different conversation every single day. So bring your questions and you don't need a Facebook account to watch. If you want to find out more about our live conversations or other virtual NPR events, go to nprpresents.org. Thank you for listening, stay safe, and we'll see you next week. I'm Guy Raz, and you've been listening. To how I built this.

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