Transcript

Rapid Response: Lyft’s John Zimmer: How to keep an essential business running

The very best founders I know are brilliant at building systems. They connect teams, they remove bottlenecks, and they eliminate single points of failure. And yet When it comes to their own wealth. Most are running a disconnected stack. A tax accountant here and a state attorney there, a wealth manager who doesn't talk to either one of them.

Creative planning was built to fix exactly that. One integrated team of tax professionals, state planners, investment specialists, all coordinated by a dedicated wealth manager who sees your full financial picture and keeps every piece working together. Proactive tax efficiency, state strategy, investments all under one roof. Creative planning where wealth works together. Learn more at creative planning dot com slash masters of scale.

Global hiring is such a headache when you're building fast, but companies like Eleven Labs are scaling effortlessly with deal. They quadrupled their workforce in twenty twenty five. Without hiring an HR team. Build your global team with deal. Visit deal.com slash MOS and start expanding your business today. That's D E L

dot com. Slash M O S. Hey, folks, Jeff Berman here. I am thrilled to share some of the new names who will be joining us at this year's Masters of Scale summit. This may be our biggest stage yet. Reed Hastings, Meredith Whitaker, Van Jones, Amjad Masad, and more.

Will be there with us October 20th through 22nd in San Francisco. If you're building something great, or you want to build something great, We want you there with us too. Join us at masters of scale dot com slash apply twenty six. That's mastersofscot com slash apply. Twenty six.

This was different than anything we had ever faced. It certainly fell to us that transportation itself is incredibly critical, whether it's access to food, access to medicine. Access to the essentials everything starts with transportation. When we started Lift, we thought about Safety from the beginning and we thought about

our own loved ones using the service and ourselves using the service. We need to make it easier for people to access transportation. We need to make it more affordable for people to access transportation. I do not look at the mission any different. Improve people's lives with the world's best transportation. Hi, listeners, this is Bob.

Welcome to Masters of Scale Rapid Response. Today I'm talking to John Zimmer, co founder and president of Lift. John began working on ride sharing with his co founder, Logan Green, more than a decade ago. Years before launching Lift in twenty twelve. They've confronted naysayers, regulatory hurdles, and competitive pressures.

But nothing like the impact of Covid nineteen. Lift's first direct encounter with coronavirus came in early March when a team member reported potential exposure. Since then the business has been turned upside down. John's manner is calm. But the activity has been intense.

Lift was able to get two hundred thousand bottles of sanitizer to distribute to drivers. Spent over a million dollars on protective equipment. Has provided two hundred thousand discounted rides for health care workers. and quickly a new delivery service called Lift Essentials. Today, John talks us through the company's decisions.

The role that rideshare can play in an urgent environment. And why he believes the mission of transportation is more important than ever. He also notes how going public a year ago. gave the company critical capital.

And why constant communication has kept employee engagement As high as it's ever been. I'm Bob Safian and I'm here with John Zimmer, co-founder and president of Lift. In this special series at Masters of Scale, we're interviewing business leaders who've agreed to share their experiences and perspective. Amid the Covet nineteen crisis in hopes of helping others find their way through.

John and his co founder, CEO Logan Green, oversee a platform that had been delivering millions of rides a day that landscape. shifted with social distancing and they're now facing a range of new issues and decisions in a fluid and ambiguous environment. John is coming to us Today remotely from California, as I ask my questions from my home in New York.

John? Thanks for joining us. Thanks for having me. I mentioned to one of your Bay Area colleagues recently that I was in San Francisco in early March and while there was conversation about the coronavirus

Mostly things were business as usual, and then suddenly, almost overnight, It seemed like everything shifted. I'm curious. What was the moment that you realized things were going to be different, radically different? And then what were the first steps that you took?

Yeah, it was around that time frame of early March when I realized This was different than anything we had ever faced. We actually had put together The first email to the company At the end of January.

Related to travel. Because we do have people traveling to Asia. at times and so That was the first communication. Then at the end of February we put together a task force. uh people from all around the company.

That would be in the role of making decisions. Around Covid. And then it was On March Fourth. that we had an individual

with potential exposure to COVID. And that we started taking the step of encouraging work from home for those that it was possible. And that Person who

Tested. Or potentially tested positive. Were they in the Bay Area? Yeah, it was an individual in the San Francisco office. They actually were never tested, they never developed any symptoms.

We were just being extra precautious. Because they were living with someone that may have been exposed. Yeah, and then throughout March It was really around making sure that we were communicating with all our important audiences.

That's the driver community, the rider community. And the internal team members at Lyft. The Right here's become an essential service.

during the crisis. Did you recognize that right away? That rideshare would be An essential service. I think like many people we were learning as we went. It certainly felt to us that transportation itself is incredibly critical for people who need Whether it's access to food

access to medicine Аксес тоді Есенчілс. Everything starts with transportation. And so some may be in a forture position where they could get delivery. Others may not be able to do that.

There's also essential workers. That need to get to All the places that are deemed essential. And many individuals or if you didn't own a car more comfortable Taking a service like lift than riding in public transportation.

Given the pandemic. So How do you generate confidence about getting into someone's car. Or having someone get into your car

When there's fear of infection. Yeah, again, a lot of this was a lot of people were learning As we went, but Just like when we started Lift, we thought about Safety from the beginning. And we thought about

our own loved ones using the service and ourselves using the service. So we use the same lens. So we quickly put together The medical advice that came from various sources like the CDC. To recommend cleaning procedures. Obviously, we identified that certain things like sanitizer were in very high demand in the early days, and we had been very fortunate really early on to secure it.

About two hundred thousand bottles of sanitizer. And we began distribution to drivers in the community and we continue to distribute those. And more recently. we've made an investment in masks as well. And so I think to date we've spent over a miljan dollars

On protective equipment. Making sure that we're not getting in the way Of supply chains that are needed for medical workers. But also making sure that we're doing everything possible for our drivers and riders to be best protected. Yeah, that's a tricky balance. You don't want to step in the way of the health workers, the frontline workers, but on the other hand

They can't get to their Places of work if They don't have a way to get there. Right. The economic impact of the coronavirus

is certainly expanding a lot of people Or out of work. How do you Go about helping your drivers in this environment.

So a few things. One of the things that I think surprised people Within those first couple weeks We provided openings and referrals to other places of getting work.

Namely, we had spoken to Amazon and set up a specific page And done what we could to get anyone in the lift community at the front of the line when possible. So we did that really early on. There was no financial interest in us doing that. It was obviously just the right thing to do.

We also created a driver task force. And we had a hundred and twenty thousand drivers sign up to date. I think ninety thousand in the first day signed up. The driver task force The idea was we wanted to hear from drivers that were willing to obviously provide rides to essential workers, but also if there were opportunities

To dial up essential deliveries that were now Working to grow. We wanted to make sure that drivers could opt into that. Those are all paid rides. And we've been partnering with

hundreds of non profits. And local organizations who can best identify local community members who need Deliveries Or rides.

To help fuel that type of income need. That that some drivers depend on. And you're saying these are paid rides.

Are you guys subsidizing these rides or these are paid rides just for folks who need the Transportation. Both. We've now partnered with over five hundred local and national orgs, non profits, healthcare organizations. If it's a non profit, that is either

being funded by us. Or an additional funding partner. that the nonprofit had funds for. If it's in healthcare org, oftentimes the healthcare org is paying for that transportation.

But no matter what, within that driver task force, the hundred and twenty thousand drivers If they are sent a ride request, that is a Ride they will be paid for. Your drivers aren't generally at it full time, right? Ninety one percent of people drive with lift.

Typically less than twenty hours on average. and use this as supplemental income. So as we both enter or continue to be in this crisis and then exit this crisis it will be really important that we provide Income earning opportunities for those that do do this.

the nine percent that use it more than twenty hours. as well as that large majority that drive less than twenty hours. Given that there are other sources of income. May have dried up. There's been a fair amount of tumult around

gig economy workers. Some protests, some strikes, some specific questions about paid sick leave and unemployment benefits, as well as access to stimulus funds. What's been Lift's reaction to those kinds of issues? We always want to be doing

What we can for drivers. This is a particularly difficult time. For Drivers. And for frankly

Many, many Americans. Many years ago I went to our general counsel and asked her what type of benefits could we provide for drivers while still maintaining the ability for them to turn on and off The income whenever they wanted.

Labor law was written decades ago such that there are two choices. Employment where benefits are tied to employment. An independent contractor Where There aren't

those type of benefits tied to that type of work. And so I said, Well, why can't you just create something new? And I think at the time she she laughed at me. And I've now grown to understand how complicated it is. It's a really important time for

Us as a business and us as a society. Two Define new ways of providing benefits to those that perform all different types of work.

There's a concept called portable benefits that has been discussed for Many, many years. And we've put forward an initiative in the state of California. That does have health care subsidies. and additional benefits. And that's something that we hope coming out of this.

the whole economy could be better set up to handle. You've also set up a relief fund for drivers, haven't you? Correct. Yeah, so if an individual has tested positive We have a specific set of

requirements, but as long as we get a note from the doctor and that this person has been active in the past. thirty days on the platform, even if they're just trying to get rides. For a certain number of hours. We have put aside funds. for individuals so that they don't need to make that choice between

Driving if they are sick. And staying at home. Do you see new drivers? Joining the platform? Well actually to protect existing drivers

We created a wait list so that You couldn't come on the platform as a new driver right now because We wanted those drivers that were already signed up. to have as much of the economic earning potential protected as possible.

earlier this year you announced a new initiative called Lift Up, and if I remember right There's a partnership with LeBron James to give Free bike share membership to youth in low income areas in certain neighborhoods in New York City, I think, and maybe then Chicago and the Bay Area was part of the plan. Seems like that's now become something larger. What is lift up Now. Yeah, so lift up now and before

Is all about providing access to transportation for those that need it most. When we started the business we had And we still have the same mission, improve people's lives with the world's best transportation. So within the the lift up

Initiative that we've launched. We're partnering with five hundred local and national orgs. providing free rides and discounted rides. to both essential workers and people in need of transportation. Some of our partners include the United Way. Which has delivered over twenty thousand rides as part of this.

near term. The National Council on Aging and the World Central Kitchen. Getting food to people in need. We've also Provided discounted lift rides to more than two hundred thousand healthcare workers throughout the month of April.

And some of those included bike and scoot rides. Which is some people's preference on how they want to get around during this time. Yeah, I noticed that you're partnering with local organizations like the Somali Family Service in San Diego, helping immigrants and refugees get to essential jobs and grocery stores, and in Boston with women's lunch place and then there's the National Council on Aging, as you mentioned, helping caregivers deliver food and supplies. To those who are homebound.

If you look throughout society At all the things that we want to make more equitable. It often starts with being able to get somewhere. If you need to own a car to get to job opportunities Then you're at a disadvantage.

If you don't have access to public transportation. You need to get to healthy groceries. You're at a disadvantage. And so This is something we set up when we went public.

That was about a year ago. And with Covid it obviously takes on a further Meaning and we've been leaning into Ways to get essential workers to their jobs.

He also launched a new B to B initiative. Essential deliveries. Yeah, so we had done a small amount of deliveries with our B to B or Enterprise platform previously.

But we're now piloting in about eleven markets. Transporting goods for non profits, health care organizations. local governments And businesses. So examples include medical supplies

Food that students were getting at their schools, but they're no longer attending schools, so we need to get to their homes. So this is one of the things that the driver task force I mentioned previously with over a hundred thousand drivers signed up. is helping to fuel.

And partnerships, I understand, are a big part of this, right? I mean you're working with Dole to get food from warehouses to senior facilities. I know this partnership with Army of Angels on school lunches. Um, other organizations looking to deliver from food banks to low income communities. And to be clear, these are contactless deliveries. that drivers opt into and they're paid

Similarly as for standard rides. That's right. When you've built substantial wealth through your business, it's often tied up in a single equity position. The upside is real, but so is the risk, and knowing when to act isn't always obvious. Creative planning works with business owners to build a strategy around concentrated equity.

When to diversify, how to manage tax risk, and how to protect what you've spent years. Building. Creative planning where wealth works together. Learn more at creative plating dot com slash masters of scale. Hey listeners, Bob here. If you listen to Rapid Response on Masters of Scale, you may be missing half the show.

Because every Friday we release a second rapid response exclusively in the Rapid Response feed. The guests and topics are just as compelling and timely from Ford CEO to NASA's administrator to the lessons from The Devil Wears Prada. It takes about 10 seconds to find, just search rapid response wherever you listen to podcasts and hit follow to make sure you never miss an episode. I hope to see you there. Humans will never be more intelligent than AI. There's gonna be two types of companies. Those are great at AI and those that went out of business because they weren't how do we build a future.

That is human centered. I'm Rana El Calyubi. And on my podcast Pioneers of AI, we answer that question and so many more. As an AI scientist, entrepreneur, and investor, I know what it takes to build AI that works for everyone. Every week, I sit down with the pioneers shaping our future. And we take you behind the scenes of the AI that's transforming our lives. Find pioneers of AI wherever you tune in.

I wanna ask you some questions about lifts operations. Your platform is certainly designed around digital engagement. But your office may not always have been. And uh of course now Everyone is working digitally, remotely. It's different. Are there lessons that you've learned in the

Short time. Feels a lot different. I miss being able to see people To see the people we work with. To best understand them.

But what we have found to be I'd say the Biggest lesson has been overcommunication And More, more, more communication is really just the lesson. I Always thought that was true and I think it's

never been more true. So a few examples that we put into action My co founder Logan and I started doing an Ask Me Anything. And AMA Every morning. For almost uh

Full month of March. Everything That got Up voted. We answered. So there was nothing that we didn't answer. And that was really important. We've looked at

the team's engagement since that and it's as high as it's ever been. Meaning that people really appreciate the communication. And that's something that we're gonna continue to do. You seem very calm. About.

All of this. Has it Veltcom all the way through? No. I think it's important

as a leader to remain as calm as possible. I think it's also important to know that Logan and I we've been working together for thirteen years Lift is only about Eight years old.

The first five was a company called Zimrod. And the last eight years have been with Lift. The first half of Lift Was Us.

Trying to survive. As a business. And so From a business perspective, we faced a lot of adversity. We're all in this together, society is struggling. We've obviously never seen anything like this.

And Of course. I feel stressed. And I feel the weight of the responsibility to drivers, to riders, to our team members. At left.

But the only thing I can control in the decisions we make And so I always do My best to remind myself of that when I do feel stressed. Are there Folks that you go to for advice in this situation, I I know that Zimrai was around during the Great Recession. Obviously it was much smaller. Lift didn't start until two thousand

Twelve. Are there folks who've been through Nine eleven or Are there places you go to for Reflection.

Advice, commiseration. Yeah. The good news is we have a really strong team and board. And so most of the people that I'm going to Are the people that are around us. I don't have to go searching far for that. So Whether it's Logan, my co founder, who we've been through a lot together and we can talk through these things.

Whether it's board members that are on multiple boards that have run companies previously. Whether it's team members, we have Anthony Fox, who is secretary of transportation in the last administration and has seen Many difficult things. I've talked to many mayors locally.

trying to determine what we can do to help and what they're seeing on the front lines. And so I think the level of B S is at a minimum. And people are very direct. And I'm finding that incredibly helpful. How has this

Covid time impacted Your confidence in the model and the mission that you and Logan started the company with. Do you look at Lift's future differently? Because the world is different.

Well because Because we've been working on lift for eight years and we weren't working on the same mission for almost thirteen. I do not look at the mission any different. Improve people's lives with the world's best transportation. It's a very lasting mission. It's going to be more true than ever coming out of this. Again, because transportation is the root of economic activity and economic mobility.

And If you look at how we've built transportation to date, it's very broken system that you need to spend Nine thousand dollars every year to own and operate a car. That's the average household expense for the car. that you only use four percent of the time. There's no room for that type of waste anymore coming out of a crisis like this. So I would only say that the mission is even more urgent.

We need to make it easier for people to access transportation. We need to make it more affordable for people to access transportation. And once we get past that, if we can also make it more enjoyable To be within your city. and to interact with the people that you care about.

That is also very important coming out of this crisis. One of the things that distinguishes New York City where I am is the public transportation system, the subway Which some people also

now look at as maybe a place where Virus transmission might have been accelerated. I'm curious if As you look to the future of where lift's business would be. Do you think public transportation

Of the kind that we have historically had. is going to be Diminished? Adjusted Because of

This crisis and What does that mean for the kind of business that You all have. One, yeah, I've lived in New York and The public transportation system there is phenomenal.

I think absolutely. There will be changes. And whether that's in the medium term. For the next year or whether it's longer. I think sanitation and making sure that all forms of transportation are

Clean, safe. and a healthy way to get around is gonna be a bigger priority than ever. specific to what we do. Our goal is to create one app where you can get all your transportation needs.

So we do have transit. within the lift up. We do have bikes and scooters within the lift up. We've already adapted the bikes and scooter cleaning procedures because it is a phenomenal way of getting around where you don't need to interact. with another person during this time. for Rideshair specifically, as mentioned, we've been distributing

Bottles of sanitizer and masks. And we'll continue to update procedures to make sure That that Yeah.

And the Cleaning bikes and scooters, you're doing that in a different way than you had Before Is that expensive? Yeah.

It is. Lift owns. The city bike system in New York City. The Divi system in Chicago. And systems across D C

Boston, San Francisco, and other geographies. And we talk to the heads of the department of transportation and we say, Hey, look, we're here. We want to provide this important form of transportation now. We've ordered a lot of equipment to increase the cleaning because it's the right thing to do.

And we'll figure out the the ramifications of that as we go through this, but I think step one was making sure we're doing right by our customers. Yeah, how much do you have to balance in each of these decisions now? Your shareholders, the costs. the trajectory that you were on that everyone was on is different.

The expectations are different. How do you weigh that into the decisions that you're making. Yeah, first thing is the customer and is safety. That's always the first part of the decision. And so if there's a cost of

Buying the cleaning equipment. That's okay. That said, obviously. We are Way.

All of these different stakeholders. The rider, the driver. the internal team member And the shareholder. And then you have the broader community. As well.

I'd say specific to shareholders. We are being very prudent in our decisions. Again, if we do make a near term decision to help the safety of the people involved in our business, that is a good long term shareholder decision. Yeah.

One of your Colleagues in San Francisco at Airbnb recently raised an extra billion dollars to have a larger cash war chest to go through this period. Is this something you guys Think about

More cash flow? Not at this time we're fortunate that when we did go public About a year ago. That we raise sufficient capital for us. We ended last year.

in a great position and we're gonna continue to be prudent. So that we don't need to raise additional capital. In this environment Planning has become harder and harder. How far out do you plan for the future?

And how much you just Sort of reacting day to day. Yeah. It's evolved. Where we were in that day to day mode and I think we're now in a more week to week month to month mode, but we create rules for ourselves.

So we have rules that we won't break, meaning we will always have a certain amount of dollars in the bank. We will never go below that. We have rules around how much we would allow ourselves to spend in a given quarter. And then we govern ourselves based on those rules.

In terms of the predicting What will happen to the business? What we plan on is that any prediction we make will be wrong. Because You can't perfectly predict it.

But We create what we would call the most likely case scenario or the base case scenario of demand and what implications that has in the business. Then we also run a model with the worst case scenario. Then we kind of Look at all decisions through those two lenses.

Your best case and your worst case have changed quickly. But it doesn't necessarily change your Optimism about the long term trajectory of the business? Not at all. It doesn't I remain optimistic about the long term trajectory, I do think that there will be near term pain.

And that will be really hard on the people involved in our business, it will be really hard on the business itself. But we've always been long term about how we're thinking about this and our long term vision and view of the opportunity has not changed.

Great. I did want to ask you How do you manage your own stress and what advice? Do you give to other people on your team or elsewhere about how they should manage theirs? For me the most important thing is exercise.

I am a different person when I get a good work out in and when I don't. So I've really tried to prioritize that. I'm a better Better person overall, a better dad. Better husband and a better team member at work when I Work out and get good sleep.

So I think in times like this, the basics of exercise Food and sleep. are more important than ever. Then also

It's wonderful I have two daughters. That give me perspective. When I Come home where my work is interrupted by a four year old It really helps

Remind me of the things that are most important. Well, John Thank you for sharing your time and your thoughts with us today. We wish you a lot of good luck. All right. Thanks, Bob. Masters of Scale Rapid Response is a wait what original.

The show is recorded remotely using sanitized audio gear. It's hosted by me, Bob Saphion, Masters of Scales editor at large, and Masters of Scale host, Reed Hoffman. Our executive producers are June Cohen and Darren Triff. Our supervising producer is Jay Punjabi. Our producer is Jordan McLeod.

Scripts by Christina Gonzalez. Original music and sound design by Ryan Holiday and Daniel Nissenbaum. Audio editing by Keith J. Nelson and Lena Sillicen. Mixing and Mastering by Brian Pugh. Special thanks to Emily McManus, Sarah Sandman,

Adam Heiner Kelsey Capitano. Tim Cronin. Charlie Manessis. And Saida Sapia.

Visit masters of scale dot com slash rapid response. and be sure to subscribe. to our email newsletter.