Transcript

Rapid Response: The logistical challenge of supporting refugees, w/Susy Schöneberg, head of Flexport.org

The very best founders I know are brilliant at building systems. They connect teams, they remove bottlenecks, and they eliminate single points of failure. And yet When it comes to their own wealth. Most are running a disconnected stack. A tax accountant here and a state attorney there, a wealth manager who doesn't talk to either one of them.

Creative planning was built to fix exactly that. One integrated team of tax professionals, state planners, investment specialists, all coordinated by a dedicated wealth manager who sees your full financial picture and keeps every piece working together. Proactive tax efficiency, state strategy, investments all under one roof. Creative planning where wealth works together. Learn more at creative planning dot com slash masters of scale.

Global hiring is such a headache when you're building fast, but companies like Eleven Labs are scaling effortlessly with deal. They quadrupled their workforce in twenty twenty five. Without hiring an HR team. Build your global team with deal. Visit deal.com slash MOS and start expanding your business today. That's D E L

dot com. Slash M O S. Hey, folks, Jeff Berman here. I am thrilled to share some of the new names who will be joining us at this year's Masters of Scale summit. This may be our biggest stage yet. Reed Hastings, Meredith Whitaker, Van Jones, Amjad Masad, and more.

Will be there with us October 20th through 22nd in San Francisco. If you're building something great, or you want to build something great, We want you there with us too. Join us at masters of scale dot com slash apply twenty six. That's mastersofscot com slash apply. Twenty six.

Sometimes you have to go slow to go fast. We activated a disaster response on February твенті форт. Our disaster relief playbook basically lays out All the actions for each phase of a crisis.

Organizations spend on average sixty to eighty percent of their total budget on supply chain related activities. We were just on a call with UN organizations and goods that are just being sent without a real or defined recipient is clogging the infrastructure. This crisis affects people.

on so so many levels. We're servicing the neighboring countries of Ukraine as well as Ukraine itself. The need for the goods is ever evolving. I myself was born in a country with a totalian regime. And I know that peace anywhere on this earth is not a given, and so we constantly have to look out for each other. What makes this crisis different is almost like a crisis on another crisis. And so we're constantly learning and trying to improve our response every day.

That's Susie Schoenaberg, head of Flexport.org, the nonprofit arm of logistics firm Flexport. Since launching in twenty sixteen, Flexport.org has delivered aid to more than sixty countries. And now is actively at work around Ukraine. Assisting aid organizations from UNICEF to Project Hope. I'm Bob Safian.

Former editor of Fast Company, founder of the Flux Group, and host of Masters of Scale Rapid Response. I wanted to talk to Susie because in the effort to help the millions of people displaced by Russia's invasion, Getting the right goods to the right places at the right time is critical. Susie is herself Eastern European, and she has a personal connection to the refugees and their situation. But she's also pragmatic disciplined operator who has unvarnished advice.

For businesses and individuals looking to help. Susie notes that some well meaning efforts can actually complicate things. Even though needs are high right now, she says sometimes you need to go slow. To clear the way for fast action to follow. She emphasizes that the crisis is in its early days and will spa needs and repercussions for years to come.

That has distinct implications for how we plan and act. Today. I'm Bob Safian and I'm here with Suzy Schoenaberg of Flexport. Susie is joining us from her home near San Diego as I ask my questions from my home in Brooklyn. Suzy, thanks for joining us. Thank you, such an honor to speak to you today.

So you launched and run Flexport's non profit arm Flexport.org. And I understand you returned from maternity leave early this year. At a moment when The top of mind humanitarian concern. was Covid nineteen. Omicron was raging, there was lots of uncertainty on its impact.

Туда, в корти гуманітаріан фокус. Is on Ukraine and on the massive number of refugees flooding into nearby countries. When did you first realize that Ukraine might be the next or new Priority. And how have Flexport

Dot org's activities and operations Shifted since you came back in January. I was at home on the evening of February twenty third, which is when I heard about the start. of the arm conflict. But there's another moment that really stuck with me.

As you just mentioned, I had my first baby just a couple months ago. And I was walking on the beach. Carry a And it was a weekday, so the beach was relatively empty.

And I made my way to the water. Luckily the waves were loud enough so that he fall asleep. And I started to listen to news podcasts. The main question, I think it was like early February, mid February was if all the troops at the Ukrainian border were actually just a bluff. Suddenly I just felt this massive

Hole in my stomach. And I don't know if you know those moments, those split seconds where the whole world just like stops. I didn't feel the warmth of the sun anymore. I didn't feel the rhythmic breath of my baby. All that I could just think about was that our world might fundamentally change. Many of us take the status quo for granted.

But we shouldn't. I myself was actually born in a country that does no longer exist anymore. A country with a total regime. And I know that peace anywhere on this earth is not a given, and so we constantly have to look out for each other. And then before everyone is now Googling all the countries that do not exist anymore, I was born in East Germany. Yeah.

And so you have this moment on the beach. Do you then turn to Well, how do we prepare for this? I mean, you don't know at that point that it's gonna happen. We don't. But Flexbook.org has been doing this work for

Multiple years. So we have a said disaster relief playbook. We definitely knew that we, you know, slowly had to get prepared in case something was to happen. What playbook did you follow and when Did that go into motion that day that you heard that the assault was underway? Exactly. We activated a disaster response on February twenty fourth.

our disaster relief playbook basically lays out All the actions for each phase of a crisis. So firstly We reach out to all of our non profit partners. Everything we do follows their lead, right? They're the highly experienced humanitarian aid organizations and our goal is to empower them as much as we can.

So we ask them one if they respond. And two, if they have any additional context on this crisis based on their personnel on the ground. In parallel, we are then working on setting up our own operational capabilities. This means that we set up a Flexport emergency team and our Europe office. We alerted our internal teams that manage air freight, ocean freight, trucking, warehousing.

We also contacted our partners in countries like Poland and Romania and so on. To make sure that we have strong insights into potentially changing regulations. For example, for customs. And then on the second day we basically take the constant flow of information you know, that is shared among all parties to make sure that the aid supply chains are set up as successfully as possible.

So on the one hand, you're sort of preparing for how to help your partners and maybe new partners. supplies and relief to the areas in need. And at the same time, you're setting up your own independent efforts to bring your own aid to those areas. Well, it's less our own aid, right? So we always make sure that we follow the lead of the nonprofit organizations, meaning we ask them which products are needed, right? And typically they have a lot of the products

already prepositioned at the warehouses, we have to kind of almost match three different sites, right? So we have to coordinate with the parties that are on the ground receiving the items. We have to coordinate with the parties that get the items ready at a warehouse. And then we need this middle piece, which is setting up the logistics, so making sure Then we have a truck picking up the goods. that planes are ready to then bring the goods to eastern Europe if necessary, and then from there

The distribution. Mm. And so if I'm donating money to UNICEF so that they can help in Ukraine, or I'm giving goods to my local community group that is You know, taking donations. All of those things are being funneled, if they're partners of yours, through your network to be able to get those goods. from wherever they are to where they are most needed.

Exactly. So what most people are not aware of is that organizations spend on average sixty to eighty percent of their total budget on supply chain related activities. So this means Procuring the goods and then shipping them.

And shipping can be very, very expensive, which is why you know, it's really draining their budgets and while we're not only supporting with our expertise and technology But we're also trying to fund as many aid shipments as possible. Are there things about the situation in Ukraine that make Servising this crisis

Different than other ones that you have worked with. There are definitely patterns that we see in every type of crisis. However, based on the location and also the scale of the crisis. There are also a lot of differences. We are not faced with destroyed roads, for example, that we often see if there's a natural disaster, but we're faced with a huge amount of people Are affected.

We have to work across different regions. We're servicing The neighboring countries of Ukraine as well as Ukraine itself. And it's an ever evolving situation. So right now we don't even know yet. how the situation will play out. And that means that the need for the goods is ever evolving.

We had an earlier guest on this show talk about sort of sometimes the waste of shipping goods to a crisp if the wrong things end up in the wrong places, you know. Part of the reason their emphasis is in Sending cash. So that you can use the local supply chain to help. How do you Approach that.

I couldn't agree with the CEO of Mercy Corp more, and if anyone has missed this episode, please check it out. It's fantastic. Thank you. So cash is definitely really, really important in this situation for immediate relief, but also for supporting The local economy. However, we still know that physical goods are needed as well. It is estimated that sixty percent, so that means over half of all the items that arrive at a disaster site. cannot be used immediately or even have to be destroyed.

Which is a staggering number. And this did not only happen, you know, ten or twenty years ago when we didn't have all the technology. is even happening today. We were just on a call with UN organizations and their shared that for this crisis the amount of unaddressed cargo, meaning goods that are just being sent without a real or defined recipient, is clogging the infrastructure. It's making all the processes slow, it's taking up storage space. And it's taking up time of the volunteers on the ground that have to sort through the goods. So it is a massive problem.

We try to educate companies and clients we are working with. They want to donate product, you know, we are really appreciative of their generosity, but we tell them that their product is potentially not needed now. But maybe in three or six months when we're rebuilding and more supplies are needed. In the current phase We rely on the signals of our non profit partners.

And the ministry of health that tell us exactly what is needed. And so we are transporting only those supplies. And here it's really important to be very specific. So for example, if we talk about medical supplies You can't just send any syringe. Or any kind of piece for medical equipment. It has to be very specific. There's a lot of regulations. So the only way to do it right.

is to work with those established aid organizations. And the government entities. And so if I'm at a company or an organization and there's some sort of a drive where we're gathering goods Who should I reach out to to make sure that the right things are being sent to the right places? I would highly encourage to not even start a drive. For goods?

I would like to invite you to consider cash donations to certain organizations. So that they can disperse cash to the Affected population. And if your company Produces an item that is really helpful in a disaster setting.

Wait for the organizations to approach you. In our case, we invite um companies that want to help To share the items with us that they are able to donate. We collect the information and once we receive Needs list or an ask for an item.

We will let those companies know. We will only ship them. once they're really needed on the ground. It is also A long process, right? I mean, it doesn't seem like the situation in Ukraine's gonna end any time real soon. We're only a few weeks into it.

How do you think about the long term commitment versus the short term commitment? We know from experience that this will be a long term response. On average refugees are displaced for twenty years. So it will take not only months, but years. For you know family to reunite and potentially to go home.

At some point we have to rebuild. Хом скулс, хоспітос. and many other parts of important infrastructure which will also take time and for which also again physical supplies will be needed. So there will be a time for those companies and donors to kind of step in. Typically studies show

that giving is significantly dropping after the first four weeks. So a third of the giving is done in the first four weeks. And then after probably five to six months it almost completely stops. So there's no way that we can raise too much money right now. Because we know that it will be needed in the long term. I first saw Flexport's name connected to Ukraine efforts.

From a Go Fund Me campaign launched by Ashton Kutcher and Mila Kunis, who Із України бор. How did you get connected to Ashton and Mila? So actually Mila and Ashton have been long term supporters of Flexpo.org. They helped us already to raise funds in twenty twenty for bringing masks and other

person protective equipment to China and then to frontland responders. Around the world. And Ashton realized really early on how powerful Flexpo.org could be. And so he set time aside years ago. To advise us on storytelling. And Aston and Mila are doing a lot of great work. just behind the scenes. And so it was also them who started the GoFundMe campaign.

And then the Ron Conway family donated and they're also really big supporters. And we're just like really grateful and lucky that we are one of the beneficiaries of their GoFundMe. And of course also we're just like really humbled by all the contributions that we have seen. And everyone's generosity. Where does the funding come from beyond GoFundMe campaigns? So Flexport is taking care of our team. So they're covering basically all the operating

Costs that are related to our responses. And then for the flexpo.org font. We are raising outside capital. There are also many instances where Flexport will actually Pay for a specific shipment.

But given the scale of our operation It's just impossible for Flexpot itself. to pay, you know, for all the work that we are doing. And that's why the Flexpo.org front exists. And everyone can contribute. So it could be

Any individual, any company, it's open to everyone. To what extent is the Ukraine situation? distracting or cutting into some things that otherwise would be priorities. It's definitely true that our main focus right now is the crisis in Ukraine. And again, we are following the lead of our nonprofit partners. We are also actively shipping into other regions in the world right now.

There are still ongoing projects that we are supporting. We are still responding to the crisis in Syria. We're sending supplies to Haiti. To African countries, there's so much work that needs to be done. There are two major benefits

Did we provide to those organizations independent to where they're Responding to right now. One is just like the real time visibility. The supplies. Where are they now? When are they arriving? What is arriving?

And but also just the coordination. There's so many parties involved. And so communication Is really crucial to an effective operation. When you've built substantial wealth through your business, it's often tied up in a single equity position. The upside is real, but so is the risk, and knowing when to act isn't always obvious.

Creative planning works with business owners to build a strategy around concentrated equity. When to diversify, how to manage tax risk, and how to protect what you've spent years building. Creative planning where wealth works together. Learn more at creative planning dot com slash masters of scale. Hey listeners, Bob here. If you listen to Rapid Response on Masters of Scale, you may be missing half the show.

Because every Friday we release a second rapid response exclusively in the rapid response feed. The guests and topics are just as compelling and timely from Ford CEO to NASA's administrator to the lessons from The Devil Wears Prada. It takes about 10 seconds to find, just search Rapid Response wherever you listen to podcasts and hit follow to make sure you never miss an episode. I hope to see you there. Humans will never be more intelligent than AI. Those were great at AI and those that went out of business because they weren't. How do we build a future?

That is human centered. I'm Rana El Calyubi. And on my podcast Pioneers of AI, we answer that question and so many more. As an AI scientist, entrepreneur, and investor, I know what it takes to build AI that works for everyone. Every week, I sit down with the pioneers shaping our future. And we take you behind the scenes of the AI that's transforming our lives.

Find pioneers of AI wherever you tune in. Before the break, we heard Flexport.org head Susie Schoenaberg talk about how crisis response efforts are unfolding in Ukraine and the priorities to optimize impact. Now she shares what she's hearing on the ground in the region and how that connects to her own personal experiences in Eastern Europe and elsewhere. She also offers lessons that apply to any crisis. That you need to go slow to go fast.

And that joining together can produce way better results. Than trying to go it alone. You mentioned just before we started recording that you've been working straight nonstop for the last three weeks. How are you managing being in the midst of this Stress on top of the stress that we've had over the last two years.

Personally I have No reason at all to complain. I feel very fortunate. But My team and I are in a position where we can make a difference. But of course those times are

intense, right? We have people telling us that they need medical supply so urgently because right now they have to perform surgeries without any pain medication. Or without any Antibiotics. So there's definitely a lot of pressure. So someone will reach out to you and say, Hey, we don't have enough pain medication in

Wherever, Poland, Romania, wherever it is. And then you are reaching out to your other partners and saying who has some of that and who can get it there. Most quickly. Based on what you're seeing in the supply chain? So We can make those matches. Ideally, we don't want to interfere with the operations of some of those eight organizations, and they have really strong procurement departments. And again, the requirements are also very specific.

We don't want to send any painkiller, right? It has to be allowed in the country. And so they're really experts in getting the right goods. But if needed, yes, we are also enabling Uh product donation matches, how we call them. Are you in touch with people on the ground and what are they Seeing. So there's no Flexport staff in Ukraine.

But we have team members in neighboring countries and so they're working on the ground with our partners We hear that the situation is getting More dire every day, we also hear that the need for support is far larger. Then they saw it. Mm.

So every signal that we're receiving right now indicates a larger response than previously anticipated. And the numbers Uh refugees just keep Growing. Yes.

A million of children alone. Many Of the children might even be separated from their parents or any family. So there's also just a big need for reunification services. So this crisis affection On so so many levels.

Having grown up In that part of the world, not far from there. Do you have reflections on being there? Do you have reflections on the experience? Anything in that comes to mind? Based on my

Use Many of us can't remember conflict. And they don't know what it does to families. But to me it's a very vivid memory and I know how it's Affected.

Me personally We have to look out for each other, and we also have to help each other in a crisis. Because maybe in a couple of years it might be you that is needing help. And I often notice that we talk about those people now as kind of refugees. And maybe if you just take a moment and you try to imagine a refugee

There might be a preconceived notion and this particular picture might pop into your head. But we should all remind ourselves that it could be us, that you and I Could be refugees in the future that need support. And that's something I want to stay conscious of.

Is that childhood experience why you do this work? Or have there been other key moments? I once got sick. in a foreign country and was really close to dying, so I know how it feels if you don't have medical supplies. I'm doing this work personally because I saw people dying around me.

So I was in Xinjiang in China close to the border to Afghanistan, Tajikistan, so really remote. I personally contract cholera. I wasn't aware of What I was suffering from. suffered from

Internal bleedings. And there was no hospital infrastructure available, at least not similar to how you and I might think of a hospital, right, when we hear the word. People tried to treat me, but they weren't even tools to just give me an IV, for example. There was just literally a plastic back.

Like an open needle, right? Which was really scary. And I was the only foreigner. In this hall. They placed me in the middle.

But around me there were other sick patients. And I remember well that the families of those patients brought in food. But there's no meal service. And whenever someone died, you heard those people scream and cry. And I still remember those cries really vividly.

The desperation I was fortunate enough. Because I still had some money. and was able to get some medical supplies and could arrange an airlift out of this region. All the other people that were with me that day in that room didn't have this opportunity. And so I know how critical those medical supplies are.

And how large the desperation is if you don't have access to basic necessities. Thanks for Sharing that with us. Stories like yours. often have such an impact on the listeners here, and I know there are folks out there who've seen

A huge need in the world like you have by experiencing it firsthand. And are on their own journey to solve that need with Their business. I'd love to shift the conversation just a bit. to how you learn from one crisis and use those learnings.

Are there things you learned in addressing Covid. That are helping you understand better how to act relative to Ukraine. Absolutely. So we know that

those eight organizations. Their goal is to provide the life saving and critical needed supplies as soon as possible. But it's so difficult because so many different parties are involved, right? And they each have to carry out actions. Pretty quickly in succession. We provide the platform so that they can see what is happening. So let's say you plan to send a plane from the US to eastern Europe. And for some reason there is a delay.

We will highlight this delay. As soon as we can to you. So if like a hundred shipments are going as normal, you can focus on the things that need your attention. And this proves to be extremely helpful in a crisis. Where there is a lot of chaos around you. So in twenty twenty FlexPort delivered almost half a billion units of PPE, other medical supplies, and also food aid around the world.

And so you can imagine with all the shipments going on. Right. You only want to see what really needs your attention. It's really crucial. that every party, so the donors, the NGOs, the shippers All have one single source of truth.

And this transparency and clear communication really helps them to be successful. So I would say that's the common denominator and big learnings from our COVID 19 response. What makes this crisis different? is we are not sure yet where kind of this will go, how many people are affected It's almost like a crisis on another crisis.

We are in a situation where we can't just fly planes in. There's a safety aspect. That is different compared to our Covid nineteen response. And so we are constantly learning and trying to improve our response every day. Flexport.org utilizes the core

Flexport products. To be able to Execute this humanitarian transfer of goods and information. How does the Ukraine situation

Impact Flex ports. Core business. We know how to ship into regions. that are almost unaccessible. We know how to work in emergency situations. And so we have like certain relationships that can also help, you know, other clients if they want to respond to a disaster.

And another aspect that we haven't talked about yet is Flexpo.org is also addressing the decarbonisation of supply chains. So that's an element where we talk to our commercial clients about how to ship carbon neutral and also all the disaster shipments are also carbon neutral. So logistics actually plays An important role for solving social and environmental problems. on many levels, and this is how we work with our commercial clients.

The benefit for us being part of Flexport is the access to one the technology. So we use the exact same system. And also our nonprofit partners have access to the full Flexpot platform. And of course, we have also access to the expertise of all FlexPod employees, which is really helpful in this crisis. You mentioned that one of FlexFort's products is carbon tracking for commercial shipments. So you're applying that same lens to the Flexport.org shipping.

We do, and we even go one step further. All disaster Relief shipments. A carbon mutual meaning Flexport is covering the costs.

compensating for the emissions that are related to those shipments. We know that the emissions in the transportation sectors are still rising. It's contributing to climate change, and a lot of people that already live in poverty. are overly affected by climate change. And so we have to make sure that we address this problem. It's one of the reasons why we are sending planes to that region. It's kind of ironically if we wouldn't take care. Of the emissions as well. What do you think people most misunderstand about the humanitarian aid business?

Most people might not understand that sometimes you have to go slow to go fast. In our case it means it doesn't matter if something is on a plane first. It matters what's arriving first. If it's just getting stuck in a warehouse because there's no one to distribute it You didn't really reach your goal.

And so the upfront planning Making sure that the whole process is set up correctly is extremely important. And my second point. Would probably be around how complex Those responses are in general.

So I really appreciate that everyone wants to help. But my big call to action would be to support existing organizations. If you're trying to set up a disaster relief operation for the first time in your life, it might just be hard for you to navigate the system. But you could still volunteer your time and resources to an existing organization.

and help them to get better. So there's so much need out there. So join us. If people wanna support your efforts financially. Do they go to go fund me?

Do they go directly to Flexport.org? They can definitely visit Flexpo dot org slash donate. So that's Flexport. dot or g slash donate If someone is managing corporate donations or matching programs, they can also email relief at flexpot.com.

And then lastly, I totally understand that not everyone can contribute right now, or maybe they already supported other great organizations, but it would mean a whole lot to me if you can just spread the word. about our work. So that we can support our fantastic partners in the long run. Well, thank you so much for doing this, Susie. I really appreciate it. I learned a lot. Thank you.

Masters of Scale Rapid Response is a wait what original. The show is recorded remotely using sanitized audio gear. I'm your rapid response host, Bob Safi, and host for Masters of Scale is Reed Hoffman. Our executive producers are June Cohen and Darren Triff. Our supervising producer is Jay Punjabi.

Our producers are Jordan McCloud, Christina Gonzales, and Marie McCoy Thompson. Our music director is Ryan Holliday. Original music and sound design by Daniel Nissenbaum and the Holiday Brothers. Audio editing by Keith J. Nelson, Steven Davies, Andrew Knalt, and Mike Gallagher. Mixing and Mastering by Aaron Bastanelli.

Special thanks to Emily McManus, Sarah Sandman, Kelsey Capitano, Tim Cronin, Charlie Menessis, Adam Heiner. Anna Pizzino, Ben Richardson, Mina Kurosawa, Saida Sapieva, and Colin Howard. Become a member of Masters of Scale to get access to a year's worth of courses and content on the Masters of Scale Courses app. Find out more at masters of scale.com slash membership. Visit masters of scale.com slash rapid response to find the transcript for this episode, and be sure to subscribe to our email newsletter.